Golden

[yogi]

https://video.twimg.com/amplify_video/1 ... .mp4?tag=3

I ran across a video showing how (99.9%) pure gold is made. It's nothing surprising, but I found it a very interesting documentary about the process. It runs a few minutes if you view the whole thing.

[Kellemora]

Now that was a very interesting video Yogi, thanks for sharing it.

At one time, I owned three 5 gram bars and half a dozen 1 gram bars.
I did have some gold foil pieces but they really had no cash value, since they were glued to a red felt display card.

I went through a small plant down in Fenton, MO, where they extracted the gold from electronics components.
It was quite an operation, so they must have been making good money at it.
But I think the bulk of their money came from other things and not just the gold, because they didn't get all that much gold.
The gold reclamation part of the operation is where they had the tour, and always outside a row of glass windows.
You walked down a hall, pushed a button at each window to hear a recording of what operation was taking place.
And even though you could look in the windows, you really couldn't see what was actually happening at most of the windows.
But some of what they did show in the final few windows was sorta like what we saw in the video you displayed.
They did not put it into fancy gold bars, it just went into industrial like ingots and that is how it was sold.

[yogi]

One Troy Ounce of gold is currently going for $1700-$1800. That would be the price for the 99.9% pure stuff, which I am sure is not the quality of the gold being reclaimed in that Fenton factory. Electronics has a lot of other metals and rare elements besides the precious metals. I've seen a video where they simply grind up the electronics into something like a powder and then extract the elements like they do in an oil refinery. I don't know what it would cost to get an ounce of gold that way, but it's probably not cheap. I'm thinking the reclamation center likely made a lot of it's profit from the copper which would be easier to extract than the gold.

I thought about requesting one of those gold coins for a 50th anniversary commemoration. A couple grams of gold would be a lovely thing to have, but would also be useless for anything other than a keepsake. I couldn't trade in gold for groceries, for example, but there is a shop here in O'Fallon that has a sign in their window saying "We Buy Gold." I"m sure they are talking about jewelry and would not give me what a gold coin would be worth.

[ocelotl]

I bought a few bullion coins as a SHTF caution, mainly got stuff that is easily identifiable, reliable and has real inherent value, and minted here in Mexico. They are pretty coins. worldcoingalley_dot_com has photos of lots of coins from all over the world

A couple of the circulated ones I kept, It's been said that they are part of the last batch of widely circulated coins that had any precious metal content anywhere in the world. The center of the 1992-1995 10 nuevos pesos coins had 1/6th of a troy ounce of pure silver, and the center of the 20 nuevos pesos had 1/4th of an ounce of pure silver...





The good point of it all is that according to Mexican monetary law, any coin with precious metal content can also be taken as cash at metal value by any bank in Mexican territory, so if someone shows up at the any border control declaring a stack of precious metal coins at face value, will get a fine if the metal value is beyond the permitted US$10,000 and another for lying.

Current Mexican Monetary Law

[yogi]

That's a lot of law for currency. LOL

The coins in the picture are beautiful. I would be hesitant to spend them anywhere even if it were legal to do so. I guess transporting precious metals is frowned upon by most governments. I don't see why they would object to bringing it in, but it is understandable that they would control any exporting. I don't quite understand the fine you site for "lying." People at the border checkpoints do not have any control over the market value of metals. It would seem unfair to fine somebody for an event they have no control over.

[Kellemora]

I actually had no trouble selling my few little ingots, and got something like 2% under current trade value.
Since gold always seems to go up, that 2% for the dealer was probably more like 4 to 5% when he sold it.
Gold is not treated like a car, blue book, red book prices. It usually sells for the days rate minus a transaction fee.
On the bright side, from the time I bought it, until the time I sold it, it had nearly doubled in value.

[yogi]

Like most other solid investments gold appreciates in value over time. When I was graduating from high school you could get an ounce of gold for under $35. Today it's worth about 48 times that much. I guess there are some good effects related to inflation.

[Kellemora]

Instead of gold or silver, my brother began stockpiling platinum.
His only problem was, the platinum he was stockpiling was an industrial grade.
Like used to make nitric acid, and also the grade used in catalytic converters.
In fact, that is how he got most of it, not from cars, but from wood burning stoves that shipped with catalytic converters.
He figured he would make a haul from it, and it backfired when he found out it was a super low grade, hi hi.

I had a lot of gold rings and jewelry I amassed over the years, some from my grandparents, some from my parents, and some from my late wife. Every time we took it to see what it was worth, we thought the price was way too low.
Then as luck has it, when it came time I had to sell it all, we found a fair person who offered us much more than we thought it was really worth, based on previous quotes we got. I'm sure we only got like 20% of it's true value, but that was a lot to us at the time.

[yogi]

I don't know who did the appraisal for your jewelry, but if it was anyone working with a jewelry business you could not expect to get the fair market value. That fair price is what the jeweler would get selling it so that in order to make a profit he would have to buy it (from you) at a lower price. The other factor is the quality. I am pretty sure 24 karat gold is easy to identify, but anything less takes a trained eye or an assayer to determine how much precious metal is being talked about. Somebody might tell you it's 12 karat when it's really 18 karat, and how would you know? By the time you get it all assayed and appraised the cost might exceed what you can sell it for. LOL

Gold, like platinum, comes in various grades or purity. From what I understand pure platinum is a rare item. It's almost always palladium that is used in jewelry. I really don't know which, palladium or platinum, is used in industrial processes such as catalytic converters. My instincts would tell me that it can't be high quality stuff when used in such mass quantities.

[ocelotl]

For the very same reasons you point, I've tried to stick with low premium coinage. Gold, even when most portable, is harder to sell at the right price, but silver, specially down here, is easier to exchange for cash. Point is finding the right place to buy and to sell, since they are not usually the same. The trouble with platinum is that is more difficult to identify and scarcer in a reliable form, so as a trade it tends to depend on the benevolence of the buyer.

* Edition *

Just a show off, next to something you may identify...

[yogi]

I recognize the quarter. That's about it. LOL

[Kellemora]

When I was in the hot foil stamping business, I very rarely had to use REAL 18 or 24 k gold foils. About the only place the real stuff was used was on Bibles and high end items like briefcases, etc.
Nevertheless, I saved all the spent carrier ribbons of the Real stuff, and kept the grades separate, because I had a guy who would buy them back from me for about 1/2 of what I paid for a new reel.
On some items I did for folks using the real gold, I would reuse the used film and stamp two or three times to make sure there were no gaps on the letters. So the person who owned the object had a much thicker layer than a one shot pass with a new film.

About 15 to 18 years ago, I used to go with a couple of guys up in the mountains where we panned for gold. They always got enough to make it worth their while. I was just along for the ride, to help a little bit, but basically to stay out of the way as they worked the finer steps of the process. I did learn quite a bit from them, but it wasn't something I was interested in pursuing, not after I saw all the work involved to make only about a couple hundred bucks, hi hi.

[yogi]

Way back in the Middle Ages when I was a kid attending a Catholic grammar school, we all had to attend Mass before the school day started. This was a Polish school and church and I believe a lot of the old country churches looked like this one. It was more of a cathedral than a simple church. It had five altars, for example. Once a year, I believe it was around Easter, all five altars were used simultaneously. Priests were imported from surrounding parishes to say Mass in this beautiful church.

There were stained glass windows as you would expect, but also paintings on the walls and ceilings like those you have seen by Michael Angelo in Rome. Along the walls were pillars that were not really pillars. They were extremely ornate and seemed to be hand carved halves of pillars embedded into the walls. These pillars were nearly a foot in diameter and went all the way up to the arches holding up the ceiling. They were all decorated with gold leaf and painted sculptures. My words can't do it justice. I never saw another church like it. The reason I bring this up is the gold leafing. I don't know how many pounds of gold were on those pillars but the priests begged for months (maybe years) for donations to have them all restored. That was eventually done before I graduated in fact.

About 15-20 years ago I attended a funeral in that church. A good friend of my mom passed away and she wanted to be buried from there. It was her old neighborhood just as it was mine. My heart sunk when I went into the church for the services. Those pillars were still there but painted over with a muddy looking gray color. All the side altars were removed, but the alcoves they were in remained. A whole different class of people had moved into the neighborhood and they simply could not afford to keep up the maintenance. My understanding is that the school, the convent, and the rectory on the property have all been sold and rebuilt into condos, or something. I can't imagine what it all looks like today, and there can be no going back to find out. It simply does not exist anymore.

[Kellemora]

I went to Katholik Skewl also, taught by the Sisters of the Most Vicious Blood, hi hi.

Only if you got down in the city did you see the larger churches and cathedrals.
Some of them were quite elaborate also.
I remember delivering flowers that we had to place up behind the altar on gangplanks they up in there.

Your church sounds like it was truly amazing during its hayday. It's a shame how so many have fallen into disrepair.

None of the churches I went to when young are still there anymore. Some were abandoned when newer churches were built, a few got razed to put a newer church in its place.
And one I attended when it was just a small place, kept getting added on to as that parish and school grew.

The very first school I ever went to was a one room wood frame schoolhouse. It had been moved to the back of the property as a new huge school was being built in its place. The new school was nearly done when I started Kindergarten, and after semester break, our classes were in the new school, but more like in a basement area, because they were not done finishing all the classrooms yet. Come the next year, they still only had half of the classrooms ready, but that was OK, as there were not that many students yet. But by two years later, they were overpacked.

[yogi]

I can't say that I'm a religious person, but I spent a lot of my childhood time in that church and its adjacent school. Back then I didn't appreciate the beauty of it all, although I did wonder why they put real gold on those pillars.

To my utter amazement the Sisters of the Most Precious Blood have their coven right here in O'Fallon. I pass by the school and church where they reside nearly every time I leave the house to shop. Believe it or not I have heard of these nuns before. My school teachers were nuns of the Franciscan Order and it is possible that the two groups were/are related in some way. The reason I recall the name of the Missouri nuns is that being dedicated to "Precious Blood" worshiping seemed morbid and macabre from the very first time I heard the name. It was just one more reason I was suspect of religion in general.

I believe the original Catholic church of O'Fallon still stands next to the school where those Sisters of the Most Precious Blood teach. It's a small stone building that I have been tempted on occasion to enter just to see what it looks like. I've not done it for fear the roof would collapse on my heathen head should I dare enter the sacred grounds. The church of my childhood was made of similar stone on the outside but was two or three times larger than this one in O'Fallon. Like my childhood school this one in O'Fallon is adjacent to that ancient church. The school is modern and of recent vintage. My guess is that it had to be rebuilt because the population of this town increased dramatically. Classes in my old school typically consisted of 50 or more children. There simply was no place to build additional classes even if there was money available to do it. Plus, everybody, even non-Catholics sought out a Catholic education for some reason. It was preferred by many over the public schools. I think it was the discipline of those nuns that was attractive because the subjects being taught were not as diverse as in the public schools.

[ocelotl]

After going to Google Maps to check the surroundings of the monastery you point out, I see the Municipality building is among the sister's complex... Comparing sizes, the complex may cover a lot similar in size to the block where the Municipal Palace of Tlalnepantla de Baz and the Archdiocese of Tlalnepantla Corpus Christi Cathedral are... and we are a municipality of 750,000... I wont enter into much detail, since there are many baroque and Churriguresque churchs over here... The altar of the Tlalnepantla Cathedral is quite fine, the "Altar de los Reyes" at the Mexico City Metropolitan Cathedral is stunning, the Basilica de Guadalupe, even when modern, is also spectacular. Also the altars of the "Templo de San Francisco Javier", part of the National Viceroyalty Museum, are spectacular. Most gold in those altars, columns and facades consist of very thin gold foil applied on top of the walls and columns...

And this needs photos, sorry if they are from wikimedia...

Tlalnepantla Cathedral Interior.




Altar of the Kings, Mexico City Metropolitan Cathedral.




Altar of Forgiveness, Mexico City Metropolitan Cathedral.




Our Lady of Guadalupe Basilic.




Main altar of the Church of San Francisco Javier, National Viceroyalty Museum, Tepotzotlán.




Altar of the chapel of the college of San Francisco Javier, National Viceroyalty Museum, Tepotzotlán.

[yogi]

My old church, St Stanislaus Bishop and Martyr, was a work of art and most beautiful. It did not compare to the spectacular altars you have published here, Juan. There was some gold trim on the sanctuary walls, but nothing like what you show here. Thank you for sharing those marvelous pictures.

Many of the Catholic parishes had a church and school side by side. That often included a rectory for the priests and a convent for the nuns. The footprint of the buildings, however, was generally only a small portion of all the land owned by the dioceses. That was true back home and is certainly the case here in O'Fallon. Since land was at a premium in the city of Chicago itself, the complex of Catholic Church buildings had to be whittled down to that which was only necessary to support the buildings. Toward the outskirts of the city and into the suburbs you might find churches with a couple acres of land. Here, in O'Fallon, where you can see the countryside surrounding the city, the landscape for the churches have retained their original size of many acres. The only other people I knew who had such great expanses of land within and around the city was the local Board Of Education. Across from the church I attended as a lad was a good 40 acres of more or less empty land owned by the board. I played Little League baseball on that land after school hours. LOL

[Kellemora]

You wouldn't believe how many different types of Catholic monasteries and cloistered nuns, and monks there are in Missouri.

Tons of them!

[yogi]

You're probably right that I would find it amazing to know the number of Catholic institutions established in this state. Other than O'Fallon fitting into the stereotype of being Irish Catholic, I've not noted much difference between here and from whence I came. There is less diversity here, but to my amazement and surprise we have a Sikh Temple on the premises. The reason that surprises me is because I see few, very few, Indian people roaming about. Although, I realize you don't have to be of Asian ancestry to follow the Sikh religion. In any case I don't interact with the local natives very much and religion never comes up at the checkout lane in the grocery stores. Over the years I lived here I have received two invitations from the curator of the Kingdom Hall down the road from me. He offered to help me save my soul from something or another.

[ocelotl]

My old church, St Stanislaus Bishop and Martyr, was a work of art and most beautiful. It did not compare to the spectacular altars you have published here, Juan. There was some gold trim on the sanctuary walls, but nothing like what you show here. Thank you for sharing those marvelous pictures.

Many of the Catholic parishes had a church and school side by side. That often included a rectory for the priests and a convent for the nuns. The footprint of the buildings, however, was generally only a small portion of all the land owned by the dioceses. That was true back home and is certainly the case here in O'Fallon. Since land was at a premium in the city of Chicago itself, the complex of Catholic Church buildings had to be whittled down to that which was only necessary to support the buildings. Toward the outskirts of the city and into the suburbs you might find churches with a couple acres of land. Here, in O'Fallon, where you can see the countryside surrounding the city, the landscape for the churches have retained their original size of many acres. The only other people I knew who had such great expanses of land within and around the city was the local Board Of Education. Across from the church I attended as a lad was a good 40 acres of more or less empty land owned by the board. I played Little League baseball on that land after school hours. LOL

Curiosity sent me search... If you refer to the one next to Hanson Park, yes, the neoclassic architecture as well as the decoration inside are quite good, given that the building is just over a century... The contemporary architecture of the one at Posen reminds me some of the architecture of Abraham Zabludovsky, nevertheless, it's an attractive building.