Hmm, I don't think I would like it pickled, hi hi.
In St. Louis County, there is a Dierbergs and a Schnucks spaced out 3 miles apart, at least on the major arteries anyhow.
We had over 20 grocery purveyors in Des Peres alone. Schinzing's market, Stall's Market, Jansens IGA Foodliner, four different German groceries some who served cold-cut sandwiches, Grupp's Deli, Koch's market, Linda's Variety, Seitz Outlet, and old one that closed when I still lived there Kookenbush. We also had Bettendorf, and Rapp's which merged to become Bettendorf/Rapp, later it became a Schnucks store. Henry Hoeh Market. And if I get out my old book I could remember many more, hi hi.
When I buy sirloin, I always buy what is called Top Sirloin. It costs a bit more, but is normally much more tender, even when cooked medium well. The trick to keeping it moist is to sear it as fast as possible first, then move it over to a cooler area of the grill to finish cooking it. This will seal in the juices. Sirloin has to be cooked fairly fast or it will turn tough, thus the reason for the high heat, but you don't want it to charcoal or burn on the outside either.
I used to have a BBQ grill which had a long lever on each side, so you could move the grate down to just above the gas flame.
This was the only gas BBQ grill I ever owned that you could a steak on and have it turn out perfect.
My mom had an Arkla natural gas grill that had the same feature only it worked a little differently. It had a single wheel you turned that raised the grate using four eccentric wheels in the corners of the cabinet. You never saw the flame in her grill because above the flame was a layer of porous ceramic blocks, shaped like charcoal briquettes, and you had to get them hot before putting your meat on the grill if you wanted it to come out right.
I'll tell you, when grease dripped down on them, it was about like it dripping down on charcoal, lot of smoke and sometimes flames, hi hi.
Now my dad only used real hardwood charcoal, not briquettes. So that is what I used for many years, basically until you couldn't find it anymore without driving all the way downtown to get it.
Oh, and don't forget to melt butter on the steaks as they come off the grill!
Near Death Experience
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Re: Near Death Experience
I'm pretty sure there is only one Dierbergs in O'Fallon, but there are three Schnucks. The second Deirbergs, the one I prefer, is in the next town over and actually closer than the one in O'Fallon. There is a Fresh Thyme store which is something like Whole Foods. They have things nobody else has, but sometimes a premium must be paid. The busiest grocery stores, as far as I can tell, are inside WalMart and Target. Those two stores must get half the business of all shoppers in the town. The rest of the stores share the other half. I order from Target online because they have a couple items that no other store in town stocks. I've shopped WalMart a time or two just to be able to say I tried it. I avoid them like the plague unless I'm ordering from them online. There too I only do it when nobody else has what I need. There are no ethnic stores here. Apparently the Irish name of the town is a misnomer, although there is an inordinate number of red haired people roaming the streets. If there is a concentration of Irish folks in O'Fallon, they don't have a store of their own. Apparently they don't eat anything special in Ireland. For sure they don't each corned beef and cabbage. LOL That's just like not being able to get English Muffins in England or Canadian bacon in Canada. I can find soda bread at Fresh Thyme, but that's it for Irish foodstuff.
I'd agree that top sirloin is pretty decent and also agree it could easily be overcooked. Veal is the same way only even more critical about the cook time.
I'd agree that top sirloin is pretty decent and also agree it could easily be overcooked. Veal is the same way only even more critical about the cook time.
Re: Near Death Experience
We have no store here anything like a Schnucks or Dierbergs. The closest thing to a large grocer is Kroger. You may hear of Food Lion or Food City, but they are not quite up to even Kroger standards.
We do have two Super WalMarts which draw in a lot of shoppers, but they rarely have the types of things we buy.
And believe it or not, our local mom n pop stores are usually much cheaper than WalMart.
On many items, WalMart is higher priced than Kroger, and we have our UGO (United Grocery Outlet) you might compare to an Aldi store, but they are more like a full-service supermarket, with prices about 1/2 of what Kroger charges on most items.
UGO is where we do most of our shopping, then hit Kroger, and if need be make a trip out to Sam's Club or up to Gordon's Food Service, which is rare because they are so far away.
Veal is something I never liked the taste of. But Top Sirloin is still my favorite, and I prefer what is known as Select Grade, not Choice and definitely not Prime. I hate most Prime Grade meats. UGO carries mostly Choice Grade which is OK, since they are so much cheaper than anywhere else. Where Kroger is like 5.99 a pound, UGO is 3.99 for the same cut of meat, and it is fresh, often butchered right there in the store.
We do have two Super WalMarts which draw in a lot of shoppers, but they rarely have the types of things we buy.
And believe it or not, our local mom n pop stores are usually much cheaper than WalMart.
On many items, WalMart is higher priced than Kroger, and we have our UGO (United Grocery Outlet) you might compare to an Aldi store, but they are more like a full-service supermarket, with prices about 1/2 of what Kroger charges on most items.
UGO is where we do most of our shopping, then hit Kroger, and if need be make a trip out to Sam's Club or up to Gordon's Food Service, which is rare because they are so far away.
Veal is something I never liked the taste of. But Top Sirloin is still my favorite, and I prefer what is known as Select Grade, not Choice and definitely not Prime. I hate most Prime Grade meats. UGO carries mostly Choice Grade which is OK, since they are so much cheaper than anywhere else. Where Kroger is like 5.99 a pound, UGO is 3.99 for the same cut of meat, and it is fresh, often butchered right there in the store.
Re: Near Death Experience
Prime beef is called that for a reason. It's the best grade in many ways. I recognize that there is a lot of subjective judgement that goes into why people like certain foods and in that case grading is meaningless. I think part of the reason some shops offer cheaper meat prices than others has to do with the grade and breed of meat they sell. The grades are pretty much determined by the diets which is generally a combination of grass and grain. If I recall correctly the prime cattle are fed more grain; possibly even corn. The thing about beef, and other popular meats, is that the wholesale price is the same everywhere for a particular grade. I suppose some stores would offer loss leader type bargains, but you can be certain they are not operating at a net loss.
Kroger Class stores have more variety than mom and pop can keep in stock. Being bigger doesn't mean they are cheaper, as you point out. I don't know how retail food shops work, but I suspect there are specific distributors each chain deals with. WalMart, for example, does not get their groceries from the same people Kroger gets them. Deirbergs apparently has a different distribution agent than does Schnucks. All those differences explain why certain items are not found in one store or the other. It also explains the pricing. I don't think you will find any national brand canned goods at Aldis as you would at Kroger. The gods of food supply only know where the mom and pop stores get their goods. The butcher shop I favor seems to have a meat supplier all his own. I've often speculated that he has contracts with local farmers whereas the bigger shops deal with wholesalers. Certain common meats, such as chicken breasts, are much different at the butcher when compared to Schnucks, for example. It's pretty obvious that the food distribution network here in Missouri isn't the same as it is up by Chicago. After 72 years of eating Windy Cityy food, it's kind of disappointing to discover what is not available here in O'Fallon.
Kroger Class stores have more variety than mom and pop can keep in stock. Being bigger doesn't mean they are cheaper, as you point out. I don't know how retail food shops work, but I suspect there are specific distributors each chain deals with. WalMart, for example, does not get their groceries from the same people Kroger gets them. Deirbergs apparently has a different distribution agent than does Schnucks. All those differences explain why certain items are not found in one store or the other. It also explains the pricing. I don't think you will find any national brand canned goods at Aldis as you would at Kroger. The gods of food supply only know where the mom and pop stores get their goods. The butcher shop I favor seems to have a meat supplier all his own. I've often speculated that he has contracts with local farmers whereas the bigger shops deal with wholesalers. Certain common meats, such as chicken breasts, are much different at the butcher when compared to Schnucks, for example. It's pretty obvious that the food distribution network here in Missouri isn't the same as it is up by Chicago. After 72 years of eating Windy Cityy food, it's kind of disappointing to discover what is not available here in O'Fallon.
Re: Near Death Experience
The grade of meats goes mainly by the amount of FAT in the meat (they like to call it marbling, hi hi)
Since I HATE FAT with a passion, it is only reasonable to assume I would HATE Prime cuts of meat.
Where most farmers would fatten up their hogs to sell to market, since they were sold by weight.
On our farm we tried to keep them from getting to fat so we got more meat from them and less suet.
Even after we no longer had hogs. Grandpa would go around to neighboring farms and buy their small hogs to dress out for us.
I don't think grandpa liked fat either, hi hi.
Most mom and pop shops get their products from either AG (Associated Grocers) or IGA, or through a CoOp grocery supplier.
It's about the only way they can compete with the big guns.
I was basically raised on Topmost brand canned goods. In many cases, I liked that brand more than let's say Libby's or Green Giant.
It wasn't until I worked in a cannery that I learned almost all canned goods, regardless of the name, is basically the same product, but with a different seasoning, or grade size, or mixed size.
We drive out to Grainger County to get cases of tomatoes. Since it is only one building, we can sit there and watch the grading process take place. One of the reasons the tomatoes you buy in larger supermarkets looks so good is because they are all grade A tomatoes, well usually, hi hi. Grade B is the same size tomato as grade A, but with an imperfection of some sort, but no cracks. Grade C are perfect but not as large as grade A. This is one reason grade C costs more than grade B. If a tomato does not pass grades A, B, or C, they become grade D. This box is mixed large and medium sizes, all with a minor imperfection, but no cracks.
They also have ungraded, which does mean they were graded and didn't meet any of the salable grades. These are often small, cracked, imperfect, etc. But they don't sell them by the case lots either, they are sold by a huge bin like a garbage dumpster. I assume they are used to make tomato sauces, whatever, they are squished, strained, cooked, who knows.
Where a case of Grade A may cost 30 bucks, and Grade C 20 bucks, Grade B is usually 15 bucks and Grade D only 10 bucks.
Grade D tastes the same as Grade A, they are just not as pretty is all.
Since I HATE FAT with a passion, it is only reasonable to assume I would HATE Prime cuts of meat.
Where most farmers would fatten up their hogs to sell to market, since they were sold by weight.
On our farm we tried to keep them from getting to fat so we got more meat from them and less suet.
Even after we no longer had hogs. Grandpa would go around to neighboring farms and buy their small hogs to dress out for us.
I don't think grandpa liked fat either, hi hi.
Most mom and pop shops get their products from either AG (Associated Grocers) or IGA, or through a CoOp grocery supplier.
It's about the only way they can compete with the big guns.
I was basically raised on Topmost brand canned goods. In many cases, I liked that brand more than let's say Libby's or Green Giant.
It wasn't until I worked in a cannery that I learned almost all canned goods, regardless of the name, is basically the same product, but with a different seasoning, or grade size, or mixed size.
We drive out to Grainger County to get cases of tomatoes. Since it is only one building, we can sit there and watch the grading process take place. One of the reasons the tomatoes you buy in larger supermarkets looks so good is because they are all grade A tomatoes, well usually, hi hi. Grade B is the same size tomato as grade A, but with an imperfection of some sort, but no cracks. Grade C are perfect but not as large as grade A. This is one reason grade C costs more than grade B. If a tomato does not pass grades A, B, or C, they become grade D. This box is mixed large and medium sizes, all with a minor imperfection, but no cracks.
They also have ungraded, which does mean they were graded and didn't meet any of the salable grades. These are often small, cracked, imperfect, etc. But they don't sell them by the case lots either, they are sold by a huge bin like a garbage dumpster. I assume they are used to make tomato sauces, whatever, they are squished, strained, cooked, who knows.
Where a case of Grade A may cost 30 bucks, and Grade C 20 bucks, Grade B is usually 15 bucks and Grade D only 10 bucks.
Grade D tastes the same as Grade A, they are just not as pretty is all.
Re: Near Death Experience
I'm pretty sure fruits and vegetables are graded for the same reason meat has grades. It's a standard by which pricing for the product can be determined. I'm certain you are mostly correct about canned goods all starting out as equals. Corn is originally corn no matter what you do to it after it's picked. Some companies, such as Green Giant, have their own patented varieties of vegetables and are raised in designated locations. I do not think these special varieties end up in the general food mill, but they might appear in all of Green Giant products.
When it comes to beef there are two kinds of fat. The marbled fat is those small streaks of white you see in the muscle of the meat. The suet, however, is typically an outer layer of hard fat that covers the entire outside of the carcass. The texture and taste of both are different, but still fat is fat. The tenderness and flavor in most cuts of beef is indeed determined by the fat and protein content of the cattle muscles. Each breed of cattle has it's own flavor, but I can hardly tell the difference. It's like the grapes used to make wine. It's all grape juice in the beginning but where and how it's grown makes a difference. Only the connoisseurs can tell them apart.
I'm a bit impressed, but not surprised, by your disliking the taste of fat. I don't do a lot of traditional German cuisine cooking, but most of the recipes from that part of the world use pork rendering (fat) in which to fry, sear, or cook the food. A lot of that is called for in Polish recipes too, but then Poland is known for it's pork production.
When it comes to beef there are two kinds of fat. The marbled fat is those small streaks of white you see in the muscle of the meat. The suet, however, is typically an outer layer of hard fat that covers the entire outside of the carcass. The texture and taste of both are different, but still fat is fat. The tenderness and flavor in most cuts of beef is indeed determined by the fat and protein content of the cattle muscles. Each breed of cattle has it's own flavor, but I can hardly tell the difference. It's like the grapes used to make wine. It's all grape juice in the beginning but where and how it's grown makes a difference. Only the connoisseurs can tell them apart.
I'm a bit impressed, but not surprised, by your disliking the taste of fat. I don't do a lot of traditional German cuisine cooking, but most of the recipes from that part of the world use pork rendering (fat) in which to fry, sear, or cook the food. A lot of that is called for in Polish recipes too, but then Poland is known for it's pork production.
Re: Near Death Experience
The short time I worked at a cannery, there were some things, like the corn you mentioned, that we did grade.
They had these big screen racks that vibrated, and machines that cut the kernels from the cob, back to that machine in a minute.
The kernels that came out of the cutting machine went on the top grid, medium kernels, which were the majority passed through the top screen onto the middle screen, and of course the smaller kernels fell down to the last screen. A conveyor under the last screen brought anything small that fell through back to the cutting machine. The corn from the top screen also went back to the cutting machine area, usually there was not much on this screen.
OK, the middle screen, Grade A whole kernel corn went to the canning section for top name brands.
The second screen, Grade C whole kernel corn went to the canning section also for top name brands.
At the end of the canning run, there was always a large bin of corn of both grades, but not enough to do an entire autoclave full.
What was left in the Grade A bin, and what was left in the Grade C bin, were mixed together and sent to the canning section for store brands as Grade B, what was left in the bin, not enough to do an autoclave full, went back to the cutting room.
Now back to the cutting machine: In the cutting machine, after the kernels were cut off, the cobs are rolled and pressed lightly to extract the corn that remained after the kernels were cut off. This thick juice went into a vat. Then the larger corn, the smallest corn, and the leftovers from canning, all got blended together and they too went into the vat. This was packaged as cream style corn and sent to the autoclave. What was left in the vat, then went to a pressing and drying room, where the unused stuff was formed into small rectangular blocks and dried, and was used for cattle feed. These dried blocks were stored until there were enough of them to fill 6x4x4 container, which was then vacuum sealed and shipped out.
Even the cobs themselves were dried and ground into a coarse powder, about the consistency of sand. It went into a 30 yard dumpster container, but it didn't go to a landfill, it was sold for some purpose or perhaps many purposes.
The only waste we really had was from washing out the vats, buns, and washing off the screens at the end of the day. Everything also had to be sterilized to be made ready to do the canning of peas, which basically used the same screening operation, except instead of vibrating like with corn, these screens turned back and forth, then dumped into the bins.
Actually, the corn screens also turned back and forth too, but they also vibrated and the peas did not get vibrated.
I don't know what went on in the splitting room because I was never in there. But I do know the large and smallest peas eventually become pea soup, hi hi.
We also canned tomato products, but that was an entirely different operation where we had steam kettles for cooking. The few times I worked in there, I only loaded the sealed cans onto the steel racks that were lowered into the autoclaves.
But it was quite an operation. They also did dry pack canning as well, the easy end of the jobs to do.
MEAT: Meats do need some marbling to give flavor and keep them from drying out when cooked. But I like to cook mine until all that marbling has melted out, hi hi.
They had these big screen racks that vibrated, and machines that cut the kernels from the cob, back to that machine in a minute.
The kernels that came out of the cutting machine went on the top grid, medium kernels, which were the majority passed through the top screen onto the middle screen, and of course the smaller kernels fell down to the last screen. A conveyor under the last screen brought anything small that fell through back to the cutting machine. The corn from the top screen also went back to the cutting machine area, usually there was not much on this screen.
OK, the middle screen, Grade A whole kernel corn went to the canning section for top name brands.
The second screen, Grade C whole kernel corn went to the canning section also for top name brands.
At the end of the canning run, there was always a large bin of corn of both grades, but not enough to do an entire autoclave full.
What was left in the Grade A bin, and what was left in the Grade C bin, were mixed together and sent to the canning section for store brands as Grade B, what was left in the bin, not enough to do an autoclave full, went back to the cutting room.
Now back to the cutting machine: In the cutting machine, after the kernels were cut off, the cobs are rolled and pressed lightly to extract the corn that remained after the kernels were cut off. This thick juice went into a vat. Then the larger corn, the smallest corn, and the leftovers from canning, all got blended together and they too went into the vat. This was packaged as cream style corn and sent to the autoclave. What was left in the vat, then went to a pressing and drying room, where the unused stuff was formed into small rectangular blocks and dried, and was used for cattle feed. These dried blocks were stored until there were enough of them to fill 6x4x4 container, which was then vacuum sealed and shipped out.
Even the cobs themselves were dried and ground into a coarse powder, about the consistency of sand. It went into a 30 yard dumpster container, but it didn't go to a landfill, it was sold for some purpose or perhaps many purposes.
The only waste we really had was from washing out the vats, buns, and washing off the screens at the end of the day. Everything also had to be sterilized to be made ready to do the canning of peas, which basically used the same screening operation, except instead of vibrating like with corn, these screens turned back and forth, then dumped into the bins.
Actually, the corn screens also turned back and forth too, but they also vibrated and the peas did not get vibrated.
I don't know what went on in the splitting room because I was never in there. But I do know the large and smallest peas eventually become pea soup, hi hi.
We also canned tomato products, but that was an entirely different operation where we had steam kettles for cooking. The few times I worked in there, I only loaded the sealed cans onto the steel racks that were lowered into the autoclaves.
But it was quite an operation. They also did dry pack canning as well, the easy end of the jobs to do.
MEAT: Meats do need some marbling to give flavor and keep them from drying out when cooked. But I like to cook mine until all that marbling has melted out, hi hi.
Re: Near Death Experience
There are canneries and there are canneries. One time while on a fishing trip we found a Green Giant cannery quite by accident. It pretty much was in the middle of Nowhereville Wisconsin farm country. We knew it belonged to Green Giant because his face was on what looked like a water tower just off the side of the barnyard. We were a bit lost in that this was our first trip to this particular lake but we knew to head in a particular direction - GPS was not invented yet. This one side road we decided to take is where the cannery was located and they had a hand printed sign by the road that said "Corn For Sale." We drove down this lane a short distance expecting to see a familiar farm stand but all we found was a humongous pile of freshly picked corn and a building that looked like an overgrown barn. It didn't take long for a worker to come out of the building to talk to us. Apparently they were getting ready to can some corn but we were free to buy a bagful; and it was only sold by the shopping bagful. LOL I don't recall the price but it was super cheap because we had to dig into the pile of corn and fill our own bags. I'm thinking it was something like a dollar for both bags. It never occurred to us to ask for a tour, unfortunately, because as I said we were kind of anxious to find the main highway and get back home. That is my total first hand experience with canneries.
Apparently nothing goes to waste during food processing. I know a gal who lives by a Purdue Chicken factory out in North Carolina. She's handicapped and does not work but she knows people who work in that factory. I asked her if she knew what they did with all the chicken feathers. Yes, she knew that they sold them to a dog food processing factory in another town. That's all she knew about it, and I know some dog food has "chicken byproducts" in it, but I never figured they were feathers. I would not doubt if that dog food also contains ground up corn cobs. LOL
Apparently nothing goes to waste during food processing. I know a gal who lives by a Purdue Chicken factory out in North Carolina. She's handicapped and does not work but she knows people who work in that factory. I asked her if she knew what they did with all the chicken feathers. Yes, she knew that they sold them to a dog food processing factory in another town. That's all she knew about it, and I know some dog food has "chicken byproducts" in it, but I never figured they were feathers. I would not doubt if that dog food also contains ground up corn cobs. LOL
Re: Near Death Experience
I knew all the waste product went to the dog food companies, but I think the feathers are processed into a paper additive. I could be wrong though, not telling what all they put into dog food these days, hi hi.
We used to get yellow sweet corn by the bushel for only 3 bucks. Cook it in the microwave with the husk still on, then when you peel the husk off, all the corn silk comes with it easily. Tastes great cooked that way too!
We used to get yellow sweet corn by the bushel for only 3 bucks. Cook it in the microwave with the husk still on, then when you peel the husk off, all the corn silk comes with it easily. Tastes great cooked that way too!
Re: Near Death Experience
Back in the days when I uses a charcoal grill, we would toss the corn with its husks onto the charcoal. Later on when we got a gas grill we wrapped the corn in aluminum foil and grilled that way. The final evolution was to shuck the corn first, coat it with butter and spices, then wrap it in aluminum and grill it. It doesn't get any better than that.
Re: Near Death Experience
We also cook corn on the grill, but now do it while still in the husks.
Just because all the silk comes off with the husk easily.
Just because all the silk comes off with the husk easily.
Re: Near Death Experience
I can see the advantage of leaving the husks on when it comes to silk removal. I did it that way for a long time. Then I discovered the taste of corn that has been preseasoned. It's a different taste altogether and probably would not appeal to a purist.
Re: Near Death Experience
The best corn I ever ate was when we had our farm and had it in the pot boiling within 1 minute of it being cut off the stalk.
The only things I put on corn is butter and salt.
And then there was my grandma who would put all kinds of things in her cob-cut corn, peppers, pimento's, pieces of fried bacon, etc. She never would leave a dish alone without adding strange things to it.
The only things I put on corn is butter and salt.
And then there was my grandma who would put all kinds of things in her cob-cut corn, peppers, pimento's, pieces of fried bacon, etc. She never would leave a dish alone without adding strange things to it.