Normally I can go back and my text is still there on my machine, which is one of the things I like about phpBB. The nearest I can figure while I'm typing is instead of hitting the shift key I must accidentally hit the CTRL key, and it logs me off. When that happens, there's no getting the data back.
I took a look at one of the USB sticks that has a 3 hour HD movie on it.
I was sorta surprised at what I found.
First, there was no folder on this drive, just one single file with a .divx suffix.
The only thing I could really check was the amount of space left on the 32gig stick, which was 25gb free.
Right clicking to see the actual file size only gave an unknown file type.
From the menu that shows all the drives, where it shows their file system it said exfat.
All the other USB sticks with movies on them show FAT32.
Also of interest, this USB stick with exfat will only work on our newest TV, not on the one in the frau's office, but the ones that are FAT32 do work, but not with all the options available on the newest TV.
On the newest TV you can browse the USB stick, open a folder to get to a show, or other things.
On the old TV all you can do is hit Play, Pause, and Stop, and the file cannot be in a folder.
The 3 hour HD movie is not in a folder, but still will not Play on the older TV. Maybe it don't recognize exfat?
If you format a USB stick from the newest TV it formats it as Fat32 as the only option.
But if you format it from the DVR you get several options, I just never paid attention to them, I know it has FAT32, ntfs, and two or three others.
What you don't get if you record directly from the USB/HDD slot on the TV is a way to select the file type to use to record. Apparently it picks the best one for the show being recorded. But I never saw .divx on any of the sticks before. Most don't have any file extension at all, Just a 5 digit number. However, on the DVR if you select ntfs to record to a stick it records as MP3 I think, but could be wrong, since I only did it once when we first got the DVR.
Testy Tessa
Re: Testy Tessa
xFAT is a 64 bit file system. FAT32, is, well, only 32. DivX is a brand of video codec.
While I keep my distance from anything television related, I get the impression that "smart" TV's are about at the same stage in development as were the TRS80's when PC's started to become a thing. No standards, no security, no nothing that can be transported. My answer to it all is to be open to streaming video on demand. The downside to that is it is costly.
While I keep my distance from anything television related, I get the impression that "smart" TV's are about at the same stage in development as were the TRS80's when PC's started to become a thing. No standards, no security, no nothing that can be transported. My answer to it all is to be open to streaming video on demand. The downside to that is it is costly.
Re: Testy Tessa
Ironically, we paid less for our new Schmartz-TV than we did for our older LCD TV.
And the only reason we bought a new one in the first place was because Debi's mom's macular degeneration got so bad, she needed a big screen to see anything at all. It's only a 33 inch screen, while the older one was only a 20 inch screen.
Our humongously heavy Flat Screen TV did not work with DirecTV so we gave it the old heave ho, and sent it to Karms Donations Center.
And the only reason we bought a new one in the first place was because Debi's mom's macular degeneration got so bad, she needed a big screen to see anything at all. It's only a 33 inch screen, while the older one was only a 20 inch screen.
Our humongously heavy Flat Screen TV did not work with DirecTV so we gave it the old heave ho, and sent it to Karms Donations Center.
Re: Testy Tessa
Oh forgot to say thanks for the info on exFat and the file type meaning.
Re: Testy Tessa
WalMart had a Sony 72" television screen on sale for $750 a few weeks ago. That's about half the normal price and I don't get how they were able to sell it at that price. I had to think a little about it, but I decided not to get it. I would love to have something like that connected to my computer. LOL The problem is I'd have to wall mount it and it would be a lot of trouble. Not sure my nVidia card can handle something that big either.
Re: Testy Tessa
My son made the mistake of buying a TV screen too large for the room it was in.
If you have to keep moving your head back and forth to follow the movie, the screen is way too big.
Now for computer use, that's a different story. Mainly because you would have smaller windows open on the same screen.
The size of the monitor screen shouldn't matter one iota to a video card, it is only sending so many pixels for each resolution setting.
But if the screen is too big, and you try using all of it for an image, it would be like looking at 16x16 pixel image at 480x480 magnification. You will see each pixel. It would probably be horrible to look at.
I think 1080p is the limit on an HD TV, unless you get 4k or something like that. Haven't studied it much.
In any case, I think it is the monitor or TV that powers the display of the pixels sent to it, not your video card.
If you have to keep moving your head back and forth to follow the movie, the screen is way too big.
Now for computer use, that's a different story. Mainly because you would have smaller windows open on the same screen.
The size of the monitor screen shouldn't matter one iota to a video card, it is only sending so many pixels for each resolution setting.
But if the screen is too big, and you try using all of it for an image, it would be like looking at 16x16 pixel image at 480x480 magnification. You will see each pixel. It would probably be horrible to look at.
I think 1080p is the limit on an HD TV, unless you get 4k or something like that. Haven't studied it much.
In any case, I think it is the monitor or TV that powers the display of the pixels sent to it, not your video card.
Re: Testy Tessa
I think you got it right. The GPU card in the computer generates frames and sends them to the CPU to figure out what to do with them. The frames, of course, come with various numbers of pixels, and I am pretty sure the nVidia card can do 4k with no problem. There is technology to go beyond that too. 4K at 100 fps is nearly half a gig worth of pixels each second. That's a lot of pixels and is where all those nVidia CUDA's I talk about elsewhere come in handy. I have HDMI ports on both the tower and the laptop; they have identical video cards after all. To be honest I don't know what ti would look like on a 6 foot wide screen.
My vision of using said monitor with my computer would only be apropos in the gaming world. One of the games I play is an adventure game with HD graphics. It involves a hero riding his horse through various parts and times of a medieval world in what looks to be the UK today. The scenery is awesome on this 20" monitor and being surrounded by it across my wall would blow my mind. Then there is the blood and gore of fighting the enemies with body parts flying all around LOL If I did that I'd have to resuscitate my 7.1 surround sound system which is still in storage in the basement.
Nahhhh... it could never happen
My vision of using said monitor with my computer would only be apropos in the gaming world. One of the games I play is an adventure game with HD graphics. It involves a hero riding his horse through various parts and times of a medieval world in what looks to be the UK today. The scenery is awesome on this 20" monitor and being surrounded by it across my wall would blow my mind. Then there is the blood and gore of fighting the enemies with body parts flying all around LOL If I did that I'd have to resuscitate my 7.1 surround sound system which is still in storage in the basement.
Nahhhh... it could never happen
Re: Testy Tessa
I forget the name of the theater, but it was like a Cinamax theater, where the screen wrapped half way around the room.
The few films made for such a cinema was outstanding to say the least.
You could look to the right and see what was coming, then look to the left and see who they were going to bump into about the middle of the screen, where all the action took place.
The problem with that wrap around cinema was by the time you got out of there, you needed super pain killers for your neck, hi hi. But it was almost like being there in the middle of the action.
Although I have a wide screen LED monitor in my desk and another above it, I keep the one in my desk set to the old square format. Mainly because this is what the desk was designed for. If I ever build a new desk, which isn't likely, the glass in the desktop would be wide enough for a wide screen monitor.
Speaking of which. A couple of friends who have visited my house and saw my computer desk, did almost the same thing.
They bought two file cabinets, placed a single unit drawer on top of them, then placed a sheet of glass over them.
The second guy was a little smarter, he only used a piece of glass that overlapped the top drawers by about an inch, so he didn't have to move everything off his desk to clean the glass.
I get a stiff neck if I try looking at the monitors on top of the desk for very long. I just love having the monitor inside the desk, just under the desktop.
The few films made for such a cinema was outstanding to say the least.
You could look to the right and see what was coming, then look to the left and see who they were going to bump into about the middle of the screen, where all the action took place.
The problem with that wrap around cinema was by the time you got out of there, you needed super pain killers for your neck, hi hi. But it was almost like being there in the middle of the action.
Although I have a wide screen LED monitor in my desk and another above it, I keep the one in my desk set to the old square format. Mainly because this is what the desk was designed for. If I ever build a new desk, which isn't likely, the glass in the desktop would be wide enough for a wide screen monitor.
Speaking of which. A couple of friends who have visited my house and saw my computer desk, did almost the same thing.
They bought two file cabinets, placed a single unit drawer on top of them, then placed a sheet of glass over them.
The second guy was a little smarter, he only used a piece of glass that overlapped the top drawers by about an inch, so he didn't have to move everything off his desk to clean the glass.
I get a stiff neck if I try looking at the monitors on top of the desk for very long. I just love having the monitor inside the desk, just under the desktop.
Re: Testy Tessa
My first computer console was exactly what you describe, but it was store bought. I think it was one of the first flat packs I ever built. This came about in the days of Windows 98 when I got myself a full sized CRT monitor. There was a glass section in the desktop above the monitor, and the glass popped out of it's frame for easy cleaning. It was very unique looking down instead of straight ahead. I impressed a lot of people who came to visit. But, the monitor was too far from my eyes to see some things. I had to put my forehead on the glass top to read the screen once in a while. So, eventually I moved the monitor to the desktop and more or less ignored the glass section. These days with thin panel monitors I could mount one right against the glass. It just wouldn't be right for adventure games, but it would probably be perfect for office work. Anyway, I'm happy with my NEC monitor. I just look straight ahead and see everything I need to. No aches nor pains other than old age.
Re: Testy Tessa
I had two desks built for me by Sauer furniture in St. Louis, they made IKEA type furniture you assemble.
The only two options they had to add to an existing desk systems, was a holder under the desk for my CGA monitors, and a thicker top so it would not break after the glass area was cut out.
They were already computer desks to start with, with a keyboard drawer, and a file cabinet like drawer to hold a dot-matrix printer and a whole box of tractor drive paper.
Their original desks only had 3/4 inch thick tops, while the ones they made for me have 1" thick tops.
They were nice looking super large desks when they were new.
When VGA monitors came out, they fit the adjustable monitor holder just fine.
But when the Flat Screens came out, they were just too darn front heavy to get them in there just right.
But they always cranked up to just under the glass at the top edge of the monitor, so were actually closer to your eyes than a desktop monitor. I now have LCD or LED monitors under the glass, but they are no higher up than the old monitors. The top of the monitor still touches the underside of the desktop.
I'm at my desk from about 8 am until 10 pm with only a short break for lunch and a long break for dinner.
The only two options they had to add to an existing desk systems, was a holder under the desk for my CGA monitors, and a thicker top so it would not break after the glass area was cut out.
They were already computer desks to start with, with a keyboard drawer, and a file cabinet like drawer to hold a dot-matrix printer and a whole box of tractor drive paper.
Their original desks only had 3/4 inch thick tops, while the ones they made for me have 1" thick tops.
They were nice looking super large desks when they were new.
When VGA monitors came out, they fit the adjustable monitor holder just fine.
But when the Flat Screens came out, they were just too darn front heavy to get them in there just right.
But they always cranked up to just under the glass at the top edge of the monitor, so were actually closer to your eyes than a desktop monitor. I now have LCD or LED monitors under the glass, but they are no higher up than the old monitors. The top of the monitor still touches the underside of the desktop.
I'm at my desk from about 8 am until 10 pm with only a short break for lunch and a long break for dinner.
Re: Testy Tessa
That unit from Sauer sounds pretty much like the one I had. The only thing I didn't like is that it was made from particle board and paper thin laminate. The lamination wore out the first year, but the particle board held together for the life of the unit. It weighed a ton and was too big to move out of the room. It would not fit through the door once assembled. So, when the time came to remodel the Command and Control Center I had to partially disassemble the desk and move it out in pieces. I replaced it with something from Ikea. 
Re: Testy Tessa
Mine is basically the same way, but instead of gluing the top to the pegs as instructed, the top was just set down over the pegs after the left and right sections were set-up and the modesty panel in place over the back, which kept even the front of the components square.
Each of my two desks were packaged in three separate boxes, partly due to weight, and partly because of the size of the top. The top alone is 5 feet wide, 30 inches deep, and 1 inch thick, marine grade particleboard. Water don't make it puff up like regular particleboard.
All the raw edges have a Formica type edging, but the insides are like printed paper glued to the wood. The exterior sides and front are like a super-thin embossed laminate plastic, similar to a thin Formica.
The top of the desk was more like the inside of the desk, a printed paper, however it had a gel-coat over it, like a poured top table, but super thin. It took about ten years for the clear plastic to wear through to the woodgrain under it, but then only another year for the woodgrain to wear through to the particleboard. The area that wore out first was the 2 inch wide strip below the cutout for the glass, where it naturally got the most wear.
Right after I moved south, before setting up my new office, I used a razor knife to score from both edges of the glass off the desktop so I could remove cleanly the parts that were not worn through. For about five years, I had a piece of bathroom wall plastic glued down to this area, then it finally came loose.
I swapped my desks around and took the least used one for myself, but before using it, I removed all of the desktop thin plastic and painted the top with a dark tan automotive enamel. After about another five years of use, it too has now worn back down to the particleboard on that little two inch wide section between me and the glass insert. And that is the way it will stay until I die, more than likely.
Each of my two desks were packaged in three separate boxes, partly due to weight, and partly because of the size of the top. The top alone is 5 feet wide, 30 inches deep, and 1 inch thick, marine grade particleboard. Water don't make it puff up like regular particleboard.
All the raw edges have a Formica type edging, but the insides are like printed paper glued to the wood. The exterior sides and front are like a super-thin embossed laminate plastic, similar to a thin Formica.
The top of the desk was more like the inside of the desk, a printed paper, however it had a gel-coat over it, like a poured top table, but super thin. It took about ten years for the clear plastic to wear through to the woodgrain under it, but then only another year for the woodgrain to wear through to the particleboard. The area that wore out first was the 2 inch wide strip below the cutout for the glass, where it naturally got the most wear.
Right after I moved south, before setting up my new office, I used a razor knife to score from both edges of the glass off the desktop so I could remove cleanly the parts that were not worn through. For about five years, I had a piece of bathroom wall plastic glued down to this area, then it finally came loose.
I swapped my desks around and took the least used one for myself, but before using it, I removed all of the desktop thin plastic and painted the top with a dark tan automotive enamel. After about another five years of use, it too has now worn back down to the particleboard on that little two inch wide section between me and the glass insert. And that is the way it will stay until I die, more than likely.
Re: Testy Tessa
The desk I'm using now is showing signs of wear after only three years. It was a quick purchase and not intended to last long, but I didn't think it would age so quickly. I got myself a can of stain to match the color of the desk. I intend to dab the worn spots with stain to at least maintain the color.
One of the restaurants we eat at has wooden table tops with memorabilia embedded from the 50's and 60's. There is about a half inch of poured resin or epoxy or something that is clear so that you can see the trinkets buried into the tabletop. I like that idea and am guessing it would not be too difficult to make a framed desktop that I can pour something similar into it. It probably would cost more than buying a new desk, but it would last forever. Which is something I can't say for myself.
One of the restaurants we eat at has wooden table tops with memorabilia embedded from the 50's and 60's. There is about a half inch of poured resin or epoxy or something that is clear so that you can see the trinkets buried into the tabletop. I like that idea and am guessing it would not be too difficult to make a framed desktop that I can pour something similar into it. It probably would cost more than buying a new desk, but it would last forever. Which is something I can't say for myself.
Re: Testy Tessa
A lot of discount particleboard furniture now has a thin resin coating over the paper top, whether it be woodgrain or marble. We have a couple of these pieces of furniture from Big Lots, they look great, and the tops don't seem to wear out.
I made a slate tile seat in the bathroom shower and intended on pouring a resin coat over it.
Never got around to it, and now I have to redo the seat, hi hi. Slate flakes apart fast.
I used clear automotive lacquer on an end table, and the darn stuff must not have dried properly.
After a few years it began to alligator, and if you set something on it with a felt bottom and left it in place for a long time, the fuzz would get embedded in the plastic. It was not a two part mixture, just an aerosol.
However, I've had epoxy blends do the same thing to me also.
Ever since, I always used twice as much hardener as they suggested.
I made a slate tile seat in the bathroom shower and intended on pouring a resin coat over it.
Never got around to it, and now I have to redo the seat, hi hi. Slate flakes apart fast.
I used clear automotive lacquer on an end table, and the darn stuff must not have dried properly.
After a few years it began to alligator, and if you set something on it with a felt bottom and left it in place for a long time, the fuzz would get embedded in the plastic. It was not a two part mixture, just an aerosol.
However, I've had epoxy blends do the same thing to me also.
Ever since, I always used twice as much hardener as they suggested.
Tessa Revisited
As of this writing I STILL have a goal to be able to pre-install any version of Linux on a USB stick and then boot that from my Windows 10 based laptop. My target test system has been Linux Mint, version 19.2. Until we got sidetracked, this thread was about my adventures trying to accomplish that goal.
To recap a bit, I'm trying to wean myself off MBR operating systems and settle into an UEFI boot scheme permanently. My laptop is the hardware of choice for experimentation because I don't want to upset the balance in my tower which is fully MBR operated. Along the path of learning about efi partitions and UEFI boot processes I managed to configure multibooting Windows 10 alongside three Linux OS's. The process was complicated by the fact that the laptop has an Optimus enabled nVidia card which Windows loves and Linux doesn't; or to be fair didn't but does now.
The next step is to boot any random Linux OS installed on USB memory.
The secret to success, in theory, is to format the USB memory stick as gpt and to include an efi partition so that UEFI booting may be accomplished. There is more than one way to create that kind of memory stick, and I soon came to the realization the method of creation could be critical. My first serious attempt was to create the efi USB memory stick from inside the Windows 10 operating system. When that was done the efi partition for Windows was altered to reflect the fact that a bootable operating system resided on a USB memory stick with a specific UUID. Thus the Windows bootloader knew to look for that memory stick at a given UUID location. When I changed USB memory stick to load a different Linux OS, Windows got confused because the UUID associated with the original memory stick did not exist anymore. To add confusion to the complexity of it all, that second USB stick had Linux Mint 19.2 installed. If you recall from previous rants in this thread, Linux Mint calls itself Linux Ubuntu in the efi partition. This dual identity for Ubuntu proved to be too much for my poor little laptop. It refused to boot anything but Windows after that.
So, the natural thing to do was to erase two of the three Linux OS's and reinstall them. This was my attempt to straighten out the UEFI boot scripts in the efi partition. It was partially successful. The failure was that one of the two versions of Linux that I reinstalled changed the UUID of the OS's installed in partitions other than its own. So far I've found no other Linux distribution that makes that kind of alteration other than Kali. So, today, as it stands, I figured it all out and everything is working as it should. Windows, Ubuntu, Kali, and Mageia all boot and use the nVidia hardware as expected.
Today I decided to attempt creating a fully independent USB memory stick version of Linux Mint yet again. I downloaded a fresh copy and saved it to my Linux Ubuntu installation on the laptop. Then I decided to use Ubuntu instead of Windows to create the USB stick. A different program was used for this purpose, but one I was already familiar with. The mkusb program for Linux is designed to make a bootable USB stick with UEFI capabilities. Howefer, it accomplishes this task by creating an iso with persistence. In other words it makes a live CD that has memory. That live CD/USB, in turn, can be used to install Linux on some other media. All this is done by booting the live CD/USB and copying it's contents to a second USB stick which ends up being a fully operational Linux OS. The problem is, doing it that way also changes the efi partition in Windows and puts me back into the original missing UUID problem.
The mkusb program is quite versatile. It can make a bootable USB as described, but it can also just copy the contents of the iso image without changing any efi boot records. It's a copy and not an install. Hmmmm. That was the only option I have not used in previous experiments. So, naturally, I tried it.
Not knowing what to expect I put the copy of Linux Mint on USB to the test. I plugged it in and applied power to the laptop. The memory stick booted immediately with a Grub menu. This was suspiciously familiar in that it looked like a live CD/USB of previous experimentation. Grub offered to boot Mint normally, in the compatibility mode, or as an OEM install. The offer of a compatibility mode was new and I've only seen it in the latest version of Ubuntu which uses the 5.x Linux kernel. Mint hasn't migrated up to that level yet. The long and the short of this story is that nVidia didn't work on the first pass. I knew what to do in Grub to force it and then Mint booted as expected. From that point I was able to install the nVidia drivers and end any boot problems thereafter.
Now I have a Linux Mint installation on a memory stick that I can boot into. The "install" icon we know from all live disks is present on the desktop. This made me very suspicious, but I attempted the next step which was to update the OS itself. Typically a live iso image cannot update it's own OS. This copy of an iso image updated and installed the current kernel. So now there are two kernels to choose from, just like a normal Linux install might have. I then attempted shutting down the system using the normal buttons provided to do so. The system locked and would not shut down. I forced it using the laptop power switch and it booted up normally after that. It STILL will not shut down on it's own. Also, a lot of troubleshooting can be done by creating a new session of the Linux shell; one that is in addition to the currently running OS. Typing in ctrl+alt+F2/F3 will do it in every Linux OS...except this one. I don't need that function very often so that it's not a big loss. But, this bootable USB version of Linux Mint seems to be working well in every other regard. I'll be doing more testing and report back on any quirks.
To recap a bit, I'm trying to wean myself off MBR operating systems and settle into an UEFI boot scheme permanently. My laptop is the hardware of choice for experimentation because I don't want to upset the balance in my tower which is fully MBR operated. Along the path of learning about efi partitions and UEFI boot processes I managed to configure multibooting Windows 10 alongside three Linux OS's. The process was complicated by the fact that the laptop has an Optimus enabled nVidia card which Windows loves and Linux doesn't; or to be fair didn't but does now.
The next step is to boot any random Linux OS installed on USB memory.
The secret to success, in theory, is to format the USB memory stick as gpt and to include an efi partition so that UEFI booting may be accomplished. There is more than one way to create that kind of memory stick, and I soon came to the realization the method of creation could be critical. My first serious attempt was to create the efi USB memory stick from inside the Windows 10 operating system. When that was done the efi partition for Windows was altered to reflect the fact that a bootable operating system resided on a USB memory stick with a specific UUID. Thus the Windows bootloader knew to look for that memory stick at a given UUID location. When I changed USB memory stick to load a different Linux OS, Windows got confused because the UUID associated with the original memory stick did not exist anymore. To add confusion to the complexity of it all, that second USB stick had Linux Mint 19.2 installed. If you recall from previous rants in this thread, Linux Mint calls itself Linux Ubuntu in the efi partition. This dual identity for Ubuntu proved to be too much for my poor little laptop. It refused to boot anything but Windows after that.
So, the natural thing to do was to erase two of the three Linux OS's and reinstall them. This was my attempt to straighten out the UEFI boot scripts in the efi partition. It was partially successful. The failure was that one of the two versions of Linux that I reinstalled changed the UUID of the OS's installed in partitions other than its own. So far I've found no other Linux distribution that makes that kind of alteration other than Kali. So, today, as it stands, I figured it all out and everything is working as it should. Windows, Ubuntu, Kali, and Mageia all boot and use the nVidia hardware as expected.
Today I decided to attempt creating a fully independent USB memory stick version of Linux Mint yet again. I downloaded a fresh copy and saved it to my Linux Ubuntu installation on the laptop. Then I decided to use Ubuntu instead of Windows to create the USB stick. A different program was used for this purpose, but one I was already familiar with. The mkusb program for Linux is designed to make a bootable USB stick with UEFI capabilities. Howefer, it accomplishes this task by creating an iso with persistence. In other words it makes a live CD that has memory. That live CD/USB, in turn, can be used to install Linux on some other media. All this is done by booting the live CD/USB and copying it's contents to a second USB stick which ends up being a fully operational Linux OS. The problem is, doing it that way also changes the efi partition in Windows and puts me back into the original missing UUID problem.
The mkusb program is quite versatile. It can make a bootable USB as described, but it can also just copy the contents of the iso image without changing any efi boot records. It's a copy and not an install. Hmmmm. That was the only option I have not used in previous experiments. So, naturally, I tried it.
Not knowing what to expect I put the copy of Linux Mint on USB to the test. I plugged it in and applied power to the laptop. The memory stick booted immediately with a Grub menu. This was suspiciously familiar in that it looked like a live CD/USB of previous experimentation. Grub offered to boot Mint normally, in the compatibility mode, or as an OEM install. The offer of a compatibility mode was new and I've only seen it in the latest version of Ubuntu which uses the 5.x Linux kernel. Mint hasn't migrated up to that level yet. The long and the short of this story is that nVidia didn't work on the first pass. I knew what to do in Grub to force it and then Mint booted as expected. From that point I was able to install the nVidia drivers and end any boot problems thereafter.
Now I have a Linux Mint installation on a memory stick that I can boot into. The "install" icon we know from all live disks is present on the desktop. This made me very suspicious, but I attempted the next step which was to update the OS itself. Typically a live iso image cannot update it's own OS. This copy of an iso image updated and installed the current kernel. So now there are two kernels to choose from, just like a normal Linux install might have. I then attempted shutting down the system using the normal buttons provided to do so. The system locked and would not shut down. I forced it using the laptop power switch and it booted up normally after that. It STILL will not shut down on it's own. Also, a lot of troubleshooting can be done by creating a new session of the Linux shell; one that is in addition to the currently running OS. Typing in ctrl+alt+F2/F3 will do it in every Linux OS...except this one. I don't need that function very often so that it's not a big loss. But, this bootable USB version of Linux Mint seems to be working well in every other regard. I'll be doing more testing and report back on any quirks.
Re: Testy Tessa
I may be way off base here, trying to understand what someone else said they have done, an probably getting it wrong.
I think he said, if you make a USB stick by Installing the OS on it, it does not have to be bootable like a LIVE OS which is basically an install file to install the OS after trying it out.
Although running in Virtual Box is slower, you have more control over what a virtual box does than you do over the EFI boot.
Now if you install a Virtual Box on your computer, each OS is installed in one of those Boxes. Therefore each one will have it's own UUID and separated from all the rest.
You would just point your VB pointer to a USB port from each VB.
But you would have to have a separate VB box for each OS you have residing on a USB stick.
What he said sounded sorta logical, but the comments afterward were all nothing but pooh pooh's saying it don't work that way. You would have to have VB installed on each USB Stick for it to even come close to working.
He said not so, only on the computer, and point the VB Boxes OS to the USB port, just make sure you select the correct one for the USB stick you have the OS installed on.
It would not be switchable to other computers though.
So is probably not at all what you are wanting to do.
Although I did stop by the library yesterday, the guy I talked to before was not there.
He wasn't there last Tuesday either. One of the kids said they have not seen him in a couple of weeks now.
Nobody their either time was using Linux from a stick either.
I think he said, if you make a USB stick by Installing the OS on it, it does not have to be bootable like a LIVE OS which is basically an install file to install the OS after trying it out.
Although running in Virtual Box is slower, you have more control over what a virtual box does than you do over the EFI boot.
Now if you install a Virtual Box on your computer, each OS is installed in one of those Boxes. Therefore each one will have it's own UUID and separated from all the rest.
You would just point your VB pointer to a USB port from each VB.
But you would have to have a separate VB box for each OS you have residing on a USB stick.
What he said sounded sorta logical, but the comments afterward were all nothing but pooh pooh's saying it don't work that way. You would have to have VB installed on each USB Stick for it to even come close to working.
He said not so, only on the computer, and point the VB Boxes OS to the USB port, just make sure you select the correct one for the USB stick you have the OS installed on.
It would not be switchable to other computers though.
So is probably not at all what you are wanting to do.
Although I did stop by the library yesterday, the guy I talked to before was not there.
He wasn't there last Tuesday either. One of the kids said they have not seen him in a couple of weeks now.
Nobody their either time was using Linux from a stick either.
Re: Testy Tessa
The reason I am investigating this USB vs UEFI problem is because I was doing it successfully back on the MBR formatted laptop. It is possible to install a fully functional operating system onto a USB memory stick. It's exactly the same as installing it to a hard drive. The stick for all intents and purpose is just another hard drive.
UEFI isn't all that different than MBR in the sense that it provides a method of selecting a bootable operating system that is installed on a removable media. That removable media in my case is a USB memory. I can do it, in fact, using a single stick. It's just when I try to change OS's by changing the USB hardware, brick walls are encountered in the UEFI world.
I am sad to report that I (again) did not accomplish what I thought I did. I was indeed able to boot and modify system files on Linux Mint residing on a USB memory stick. However, in the end it was a "live" image that cannot be permanently altered. When I came back to it today, I was back to the Plain Jane unmodified Mint iso. What is more, I violated a MAJOR rule. I should know better by now but I'm getting anxious. LOL The version of Mint to which I refer here was installed on an MBR formatted USB stick. The file system is FAT32. The UEFI boot in the laptop is very forgiving and will allow booting from MBR devices. That's why any of this works at all. But, MBR is not GPT and never will the two coexist. They are mutually exclusive. When I boot the Linux installation disk in the GPT mode, it will alter the efi partition contents on the laptop to reflect what I did. Thus, that efi partition selects the boot device. Well, back in the MBR days, I personally was in charge of that selection. It simply does not exist in UEFI.
If I can install a fully functional Linux OS onto a USB memory stick that is GPT formatted and has it's own Grub menu, I would be in hacker heaven. I presume, although I have yet to see it happen, that if I put a previously installed and working OS on USB into the UEFI laptop, the laptop will recognize it and boot from it. Getting to that point is the current challenge. I have a properly formatted USB memory stick. Getting Linux Mint and it's Grub bootloader there is the next challenge.
Virtual machines can be UEFI booted. And, I have more than once attached virtual optical readers to them. I also have attached real USB memory sticks to them. I never tried to boot from a USB memory stick in a virtual machine. That sounds too mind boggling even for me. LOL It is an option I've seen discussed, however. I think there may be a thing or two left for me to try in the real hardware world before I mess with the virtual world. I'm so close and only need one piece of information to achieve my objective. Wish I knew what I needed.
UEFI isn't all that different than MBR in the sense that it provides a method of selecting a bootable operating system that is installed on a removable media. That removable media in my case is a USB memory. I can do it, in fact, using a single stick. It's just when I try to change OS's by changing the USB hardware, brick walls are encountered in the UEFI world.
I am sad to report that I (again) did not accomplish what I thought I did. I was indeed able to boot and modify system files on Linux Mint residing on a USB memory stick. However, in the end it was a "live" image that cannot be permanently altered. When I came back to it today, I was back to the Plain Jane unmodified Mint iso. What is more, I violated a MAJOR rule. I should know better by now but I'm getting anxious. LOL The version of Mint to which I refer here was installed on an MBR formatted USB stick. The file system is FAT32. The UEFI boot in the laptop is very forgiving and will allow booting from MBR devices. That's why any of this works at all. But, MBR is not GPT and never will the two coexist. They are mutually exclusive. When I boot the Linux installation disk in the GPT mode, it will alter the efi partition contents on the laptop to reflect what I did. Thus, that efi partition selects the boot device. Well, back in the MBR days, I personally was in charge of that selection. It simply does not exist in UEFI.
If I can install a fully functional Linux OS onto a USB memory stick that is GPT formatted and has it's own Grub menu, I would be in hacker heaven. I presume, although I have yet to see it happen, that if I put a previously installed and working OS on USB into the UEFI laptop, the laptop will recognize it and boot from it. Getting to that point is the current challenge. I have a properly formatted USB memory stick. Getting Linux Mint and it's Grub bootloader there is the next challenge.
Virtual machines can be UEFI booted. And, I have more than once attached virtual optical readers to them. I also have attached real USB memory sticks to them. I never tried to boot from a USB memory stick in a virtual machine. That sounds too mind boggling even for me. LOL It is an option I've seen discussed, however. I think there may be a thing or two left for me to try in the real hardware world before I mess with the virtual world. I'm so close and only need one piece of information to achieve my objective. Wish I knew what I needed.
Re: Testy Tessa
I understand! If I asked you to get me a Fork, and you had no idea what a Fork looked like. How could you get it for me?
Been there, done that, more times than I can count.
It's been a long time since I messed with a Virtual Box, so this may be a dumb question or commentary, but here goes.
You install VB on your computer. Then you install other OSs in a Virtual Box Box.
When you go to VB and select which OS you want to use, does it actually boot up that OS, or just use it?
I don't have VB on any of my computers right now to check.
It seems like when I had Windows XP in a VB, it did have to boot up before I could use it.
Here is what I do remember. VB is on the Host computer, and when it runs it sets up Guest Platforms.
I also know that VB can boot OSs from external drives and USB Sticks (I looked that much up).
Now for the dumb questions:
Since VB is running on the Host computer, and the Host computer is UEFI, do all the OSs on the Guest Platform need to be EFI or doesn't it matter at that point, since they are running in VB?
OK, I looked up something else, there is a thing called Portable Virtual Box that can be run from a USB stick.
It says Portable VB is a WRAPPER for VB that turns it into a VB you can take anywhere.
Here is the LINK to what I'm looking at right now.
To me, it looks like you can make a USB stick for Windows computers, that will hold VB, and from VB you can add any OSs you would like to add, even placing the OSs on separate USB sticks if you so desire.
But what this looks like to me, is you could install several OSs on a single USB stick and have them all at your disposal from any Windows computer. It won't work on Linux though.
https://www.howtogeek.com/188142/use-po ... verywhere/
If this works as well as the article makes it look like it does, heck you can go into business selling USB sticks preloaded with several OSs, hi hi.
Been there, done that, more times than I can count.
It's been a long time since I messed with a Virtual Box, so this may be a dumb question or commentary, but here goes.
You install VB on your computer. Then you install other OSs in a Virtual Box Box.
When you go to VB and select which OS you want to use, does it actually boot up that OS, or just use it?
I don't have VB on any of my computers right now to check.
It seems like when I had Windows XP in a VB, it did have to boot up before I could use it.
Here is what I do remember. VB is on the Host computer, and when it runs it sets up Guest Platforms.
I also know that VB can boot OSs from external drives and USB Sticks (I looked that much up).
Now for the dumb questions:
Since VB is running on the Host computer, and the Host computer is UEFI, do all the OSs on the Guest Platform need to be EFI or doesn't it matter at that point, since they are running in VB?
OK, I looked up something else, there is a thing called Portable Virtual Box that can be run from a USB stick.
It says Portable VB is a WRAPPER for VB that turns it into a VB you can take anywhere.
Here is the LINK to what I'm looking at right now.
To me, it looks like you can make a USB stick for Windows computers, that will hold VB, and from VB you can add any OSs you would like to add, even placing the OSs on separate USB sticks if you so desire.
But what this looks like to me, is you could install several OSs on a single USB stick and have them all at your disposal from any Windows computer. It won't work on Linux though.
https://www.howtogeek.com/188142/use-po ... verywhere/
If this works as well as the article makes it look like it does, heck you can go into business selling USB sticks preloaded with several OSs, hi hi.
Re: Testy Tessa
I probably have used virtual machines more than you have, but don't let that fool you. The more I get into these self-created technical situations the more I discover I do not know. The operation of portable virtual machines is one of those things I had only a vague notion existed. More on that in a minute.
VirtualBox software is designed to take the kernel and drivers from the host system (Windows in my case) and use them to run other operating systems in an isolated environment; isolated in terms of software. Thus, the Windows kernel is actually running Linux when I fire up MInt on my ASUS tower. The VirtualBox software (or VMware) does all the conversions necessary which is why it needs to be installed in the host environment. Once all those kernels and drivers are in place, then the given .vdi version of the Guest OS is run. Apparently the .vdi is similar to an iso file in that everything needed to run the OS is in the package. These .vdi files can be run on any computer that has the VirtualBox software installed.
Grub, the Linux bootloader of choice, is installed in all my virtual machines, but I never get to see it. The reason for that is because there are no choices to be made. It's like taking an old computer and installing some version of Linux on it. Would you see Grub or would it just boot into the system? I know it can be made to show Grub, but normally you don't have to when only one OS and one kernel is installed. Linux boots right up. GRUB is what calls up the initrd.img file in the /boot directory from whence the Linux OS session is generated. So, both the stand alone computer and the virtual machine runs GRUB which calls up the Linux OS.
Now, when it comes to peripherals, such as monitors, printers, network cards, optical readers, USB memory, etc, the ports to those devices are a bunch of electronics inside the stand alone computer. They are all emulated by software inside the virtual box. That is the reason why I don't have the nVidia problem when running virtual Linux. It's using the native virtual graphics processor and not the real hardware. The video is processed inside the VM and sent to a port to which the real outside world monitor is connected. The VM has no control over that real hardware, but it does have internal drivers to interact with it. So it is with all the peripherals.
I see no problem when I insert a USB stick into my virtual machines. However, I've not pondered the possibility of booting another OS from one of those real USB sticks. It seems possible if the OS installer sets up GRUB correctly. In that case when I turn on the virtual machine it will show the GRUB menu for me to select an OS to boot. I have a feeling, however, that the same problem will occur as I see with Windows. If that USB memory stick is absent or changed, GRUB will panic and go to it's recovery mode. I have yet to figure out how that works. LOL One of the things I don't understand is how the USB memory would be mounted prior to launching an operating system. It has to be mounted for GRUB to see it. Apparently the folks who invented that portable VM software have that all figured out.
Addressing your UEFI Host question, I'd remind you that UEFI requires a gpt formatted disk while MBR is basically FAT. Never shall the two coexist in the same environment. The virtual machine is not the same environment as is the host machine. Thus, I'd have to conclude that the virtual machine is formatted as you choose to do with a stand alone hardware computer. It can be either gpt or MBR. It would be like two computers sitting next to each other on your desk. Neither one would care what the other format is.
It would be an interesting option to use portable virtual machines. And I could easily make sticks with multiple OS"s on them. Would YOU buy one from me (aside from just being a nice guy)? I don't see who would want such a thing. People who are familiar with Linux would not need to run it in Windows as a virtual box.
VirtualBox software is designed to take the kernel and drivers from the host system (Windows in my case) and use them to run other operating systems in an isolated environment; isolated in terms of software. Thus, the Windows kernel is actually running Linux when I fire up MInt on my ASUS tower. The VirtualBox software (or VMware) does all the conversions necessary which is why it needs to be installed in the host environment. Once all those kernels and drivers are in place, then the given .vdi version of the Guest OS is run. Apparently the .vdi is similar to an iso file in that everything needed to run the OS is in the package. These .vdi files can be run on any computer that has the VirtualBox software installed.
Grub, the Linux bootloader of choice, is installed in all my virtual machines, but I never get to see it. The reason for that is because there are no choices to be made. It's like taking an old computer and installing some version of Linux on it. Would you see Grub or would it just boot into the system? I know it can be made to show Grub, but normally you don't have to when only one OS and one kernel is installed. Linux boots right up. GRUB is what calls up the initrd.img file in the /boot directory from whence the Linux OS session is generated. So, both the stand alone computer and the virtual machine runs GRUB which calls up the Linux OS.
Now, when it comes to peripherals, such as monitors, printers, network cards, optical readers, USB memory, etc, the ports to those devices are a bunch of electronics inside the stand alone computer. They are all emulated by software inside the virtual box. That is the reason why I don't have the nVidia problem when running virtual Linux. It's using the native virtual graphics processor and not the real hardware. The video is processed inside the VM and sent to a port to which the real outside world monitor is connected. The VM has no control over that real hardware, but it does have internal drivers to interact with it. So it is with all the peripherals.
I see no problem when I insert a USB stick into my virtual machines. However, I've not pondered the possibility of booting another OS from one of those real USB sticks. It seems possible if the OS installer sets up GRUB correctly. In that case when I turn on the virtual machine it will show the GRUB menu for me to select an OS to boot. I have a feeling, however, that the same problem will occur as I see with Windows. If that USB memory stick is absent or changed, GRUB will panic and go to it's recovery mode. I have yet to figure out how that works. LOL One of the things I don't understand is how the USB memory would be mounted prior to launching an operating system. It has to be mounted for GRUB to see it. Apparently the folks who invented that portable VM software have that all figured out.
Addressing your UEFI Host question, I'd remind you that UEFI requires a gpt formatted disk while MBR is basically FAT. Never shall the two coexist in the same environment. The virtual machine is not the same environment as is the host machine. Thus, I'd have to conclude that the virtual machine is formatted as you choose to do with a stand alone hardware computer. It can be either gpt or MBR. It would be like two computers sitting next to each other on your desk. Neither one would care what the other format is.
It would be an interesting option to use portable virtual machines. And I could easily make sticks with multiple OS"s on them. Would YOU buy one from me (aside from just being a nice guy)? I don't see who would want such a thing. People who are familiar with Linux would not need to run it in Windows as a virtual box.
Re: Testy Tessa
I wouldn't because I already have the Linux Distro's on my computer.
However, I'm surprised at the number of kids running Windows machines and using USB sticks with Live Linux Distro's on them. Especially since you can install some of the Linux programs on Windows now.
But the kids using the computers at the Library cannot install programs on them.
So all of them are using a USB stick to save their work if they use the programs on the computer, or using Live USB sticks to do their work using things like LibreOffice and save to another USB stick, or a couple save back to their own USB stick.
The only problem I see with having a Portable VB, is that it would run fairly slow from a USB stick while using another OS on that same USB stick.
I'm told that six of the computers at the library only have 4 megs of memory, and the two newest are 8 megs, and the time limit on the new machines is 30 minutes to 1 hour, depending on how busy they are. The older machines used to be one hour but are now 2 hours. They don't make you stop at 2 hours if no one else is waiting.
What I find interesting is most of the kids have laptops, so why are they coming to the library to use the libraries computers? The library also has WiFi so you can use your laptop there.
Tomorrow is Tuesday and I'm going to spend a couple of hours up there myself, mainly just sitting and watching, and perhaps hope the fellow I talked to previously shows up again. I do have a couple of things I need to use their reference department for. You have to subscribe to the on-line Sorkins Directory, and they don't have the particular pages I'm looking for that are in the published books at the library. Plus there is another set of books I can never remember the name of, but know what they look like and where they are at the library, hi hi.
However, I'm surprised at the number of kids running Windows machines and using USB sticks with Live Linux Distro's on them. Especially since you can install some of the Linux programs on Windows now.
But the kids using the computers at the Library cannot install programs on them.
So all of them are using a USB stick to save their work if they use the programs on the computer, or using Live USB sticks to do their work using things like LibreOffice and save to another USB stick, or a couple save back to their own USB stick.
The only problem I see with having a Portable VB, is that it would run fairly slow from a USB stick while using another OS on that same USB stick.
I'm told that six of the computers at the library only have 4 megs of memory, and the two newest are 8 megs, and the time limit on the new machines is 30 minutes to 1 hour, depending on how busy they are. The older machines used to be one hour but are now 2 hours. They don't make you stop at 2 hours if no one else is waiting.
What I find interesting is most of the kids have laptops, so why are they coming to the library to use the libraries computers? The library also has WiFi so you can use your laptop there.
Tomorrow is Tuesday and I'm going to spend a couple of hours up there myself, mainly just sitting and watching, and perhaps hope the fellow I talked to previously shows up again. I do have a couple of things I need to use their reference department for. You have to subscribe to the on-line Sorkins Directory, and they don't have the particular pages I'm looking for that are in the published books at the library. Plus there is another set of books I can never remember the name of, but know what they look like and where they are at the library, hi hi.