I've seen at least three truly amazing Everything types of recycling centers for mixed recyclables.
One was entirely mechanical, no computers.
The truck dumped down a chute to a conveyor, actually a series of conveyors.
Huge electromagnets pulled every steel from the trash as it tumbled across stair-stepped conveyors.
Air blowing up from underneath separated the paper and most of the plastic items.
Whatever was left on the conveyor when it reached the grinder was turned into confetti, then it went into a screw conveyer that took it to the top of a tall tower where all the shards were dumped in.
Apparently different items have different buoyancy in the towers, which may have been salt water.
Screen go down a conveyor to inside and stop at certain levels, then turn flat and come back up again, starting at the top and working its way down to lower levels.
Stuff in the very bottom of the tower, which was probably aluminum and glass went through pipes into a building.
But almost all the plastic went down different conveyors to individual large containers.
The paper and light plastic also went down their conveyor to another blower not as strong as the first blower, probably just strong enough to lift out plastic bags and cups, but not forks and spoons that blew out in the first blower operation.
I'm sure they had another tower they used to separate those plastic items from the paper but that was not part of the tour.
Another newer place we toured did have a lot of electronics and robotic arms.
But like the first, they had tumblers and magnets to extract ferrous metals.
But then other metals and cans were pulled out by suction tipped robotic arms that waved back and forth over the conveyor like the seek arm inside a hard drive sorta, hi hi.
Everything left on the conveyor at this point when through steel rollers which look like their sole purpose was to crush glass bottles and flatten plastic bottles. Then it went on the first of the grid type conveyors that tumbled. Other conveyors were under this first conveyor.
After that was a grid type of conveyor with water jets blasting down through whatever was left on the conveyor.
Paper would have been disintegrated by the blast of water, but not plastics. It had to tumble a few times also.
There were troughs under this grid conveyor that went into a building where a rotating paddle with screens for blades pulled out the paper remains.
They did not separate the different types of plastics at this place it all just went into large containers without being modified further. I assume it was taken to someplace with a tower like the first place we toured.
No where near as complex as the first two, was a place with conveyors and people lined up on both sides of the conveyors where they pulled everything out by hand. We were not told much about this place, other than they said it didn't lose money, but didn't exactly make much either. They didn't say whether the employees were salaried or volunteers, or perhaps even prisoners or since there were so many kids, it could be they were ordered to do public service.
The thing I did notice about all three places we visited was there was no garbage, so it all had to be coming from recycling trucks. Also, there was no electronics either which I thought odd. Except for the occasional small items that could have been electronics of some type. There was also no corrugated cardboard at any place either, but there was a lot of pasteboard and paper of all kinds.
That was over 15 years ago, so I'll bet they are even fancier now, hi hi.
Saw a video of one on-line for New York a few years ago. But this was also regular garbage too.
Garbage trucks dumped onto tumbling conveyors leading down to the barges.
Magnets pulled out steel, and workers plunked out the glass and other metals is all.
The paper and plastics went into the barges.
And i'll bet it all stunk to high heaven too!
Peppermint Linux
Re: Peppermint Linux
You have taken part in some amazing tours. It never occurred to me that there could be more than one way to sort the trash. I saw a little blurb on TV once which showed that last place you visited. It was a long building with a conveyor and people picking things off of it. They didn't say anything about the workers but I guessed at the time that they were all illegals picking at that smelly stuff because nobody else would want to do the job. 
Re: Peppermint Linux
I'm sure you know what the inside of a paper shredder looks like.
There are humongous machines just like them that eat up big things like furniture, couches, refrigerators, you name it.
Once it is all ground up like that, they use those tall separation towers, much taller than the ones I saw to separate out the individual pieces.
I can assume they work the same way by using the density of the liquid inside the tall towers.
Dang, I looked on-line to see if I could find some of the towers used for separating recycled materials and didn't find a single one. I thought you might like to see a place that uses them.
I'll keep this in mind and if I find one of those super recycling centers I'll save a link to it.
There are humongous machines just like them that eat up big things like furniture, couches, refrigerators, you name it.
Once it is all ground up like that, they use those tall separation towers, much taller than the ones I saw to separate out the individual pieces.
I can assume they work the same way by using the density of the liquid inside the tall towers.
Dang, I looked on-line to see if I could find some of the towers used for separating recycled materials and didn't find a single one. I thought you might like to see a place that uses them.
I'll keep this in mind and if I find one of those super recycling centers I'll save a link to it.
Re: Peppermint Linux
I would love to see anything you come up with for recycling towers. 
I posted something right here in these forums a while back which reminds me of your touring story. The author of the article I found took an Apple smartphone and ground it up into powder. Then they separated all the elements that composed the phone. That separation process in itself was an interesting story, but the point of the article was to show the quantity of elements consumed by smartphone users. I can't find it at the moment, but I think you did see it and comment on it. There were literally hundreds of compounds and elements, some of them very exotic and rare. If something similar can be done to trash, the billions of dollars it would take to build such a factory would pay off handsomely.
I posted something right here in these forums a while back which reminds me of your touring story. The author of the article I found took an Apple smartphone and ground it up into powder. Then they separated all the elements that composed the phone. That separation process in itself was an interesting story, but the point of the article was to show the quantity of elements consumed by smartphone users. I can't find it at the moment, but I think you did see it and comment on it. There were literally hundreds of compounds and elements, some of them very exotic and rare. If something similar can be done to trash, the billions of dollars it would take to build such a factory would pay off handsomely.Re: Peppermint Linux
Yes I do remember that article, and I think that is when I started talking about the recycling tower we saw at one of the recycling plants we visited.
Although I didn't remember it yesterday, one of the things they talked about was using an anode rod to extract certain metals from the column that seemed to stay in suspension and not settle into a layer.
They also had a smaller tank that spun like a centrifuge to extract certain precious metals. But that was only one step of several.
Although robotics and computer systems cost the most to build, they turn out to be the most efficient because it reduces the number of steps involved in the recycling process. Certain light-waves are used to determine what type of plastic some of them are so they go into the correct bins. Others are done simply by what they are, such as Pet bottles, and HDPE2 bottles are easily recognizable by the computers.
Can I swing back to aquarium products for a second?
You may have seen on my website at one time I sold a DI & TWP Recharge Kit.
Now I just give the formula away for free.
What brought about my bothering to invent the recharge kit in the first place was the company selling the mixed bed deionization columns claimed they were not rechargeable and that it was impossible to separate the resins once they were mixed. They nearly doubled their price for them too which is another reason folks wanted to be able to recharge them.
Well you know me, say something is impossible and I become determined to prove them wrong, hi hi.
It all started with them bad-mouthing my product, and then another company they were associated with put some snake-oil on the market claiming it did what my product did. Only it didn't, their product only fooled the test kits is all. This hurt my sales for a few years because after their scam, everyone figured mine was too.
Their product was not really a good idea to start with, because when you mix two opposite resins, they begin to neutralize each other. This is one reason their columns did not last as long as ones that were sold by another company that kept the resins separate.
The resins technically never wear out. So almost everyone who did go to the trouble to separate the resins kept them in separate columns after that, so all they had to do was do a cheap recharge, and the columns lasted a lot longer.
I think we sold enough Kits, before I gave the instructions away for Free, that it did put a dent in their sales, hi hi.
Although I didn't remember it yesterday, one of the things they talked about was using an anode rod to extract certain metals from the column that seemed to stay in suspension and not settle into a layer.
They also had a smaller tank that spun like a centrifuge to extract certain precious metals. But that was only one step of several.
Although robotics and computer systems cost the most to build, they turn out to be the most efficient because it reduces the number of steps involved in the recycling process. Certain light-waves are used to determine what type of plastic some of them are so they go into the correct bins. Others are done simply by what they are, such as Pet bottles, and HDPE2 bottles are easily recognizable by the computers.
Can I swing back to aquarium products for a second?
You may have seen on my website at one time I sold a DI & TWP Recharge Kit.
Now I just give the formula away for free.
What brought about my bothering to invent the recharge kit in the first place was the company selling the mixed bed deionization columns claimed they were not rechargeable and that it was impossible to separate the resins once they were mixed. They nearly doubled their price for them too which is another reason folks wanted to be able to recharge them.
Well you know me, say something is impossible and I become determined to prove them wrong, hi hi.
It all started with them bad-mouthing my product, and then another company they were associated with put some snake-oil on the market claiming it did what my product did. Only it didn't, their product only fooled the test kits is all. This hurt my sales for a few years because after their scam, everyone figured mine was too.
Their product was not really a good idea to start with, because when you mix two opposite resins, they begin to neutralize each other. This is one reason their columns did not last as long as ones that were sold by another company that kept the resins separate.
The resins technically never wear out. So almost everyone who did go to the trouble to separate the resins kept them in separate columns after that, so all they had to do was do a cheap recharge, and the columns lasted a lot longer.
I think we sold enough Kits, before I gave the instructions away for Free, that it did put a dent in their sales, hi hi.
Re: Peppermint Linux
The chemistry of aquariums is a little over my head, but I can appreciate your business strategy. You sold your recharging kit until you made enough profit doing so, then gave away the formula. I understand it wasn't completely altruistic on your part and that the competition could be brutal. I'm reminded of something similar in the software world wherein those people giving away a GNU operating system felt FOSS would kill the giants in this world. I'm certain those giants did suffer some loss for a period of time. However, they are still giants and becoming larger every day. GNU and FOSS is spreading too. Kind of like termites spread.
Re: Peppermint Linux
Just curious if you know that Red Hat Linux rakes in about 3 billion dollars a year.
And Ubuntu is pulling in over 250 Million a year, most of which passes on to Canonical.
Canonical made a lot of its money from the Ubuntu Software Center until they closed it down a few years ago to pursue other revenue producing software products.
I know that is small peanuts compared to Apple raking in over 250 billion dollars a year.
And Mickey$oft more than double that amount, possibly even triple or quadruple.
However, in the case of both Apple and Mickey$oft, the revenues reported is mostly from other industries and investments, not solely from the software. I think they made only a little over 100 billion from their software.
Some sources say it is much lower, only around 35 billion is from software licenses.
Another staggering figure is how many Windows users have downloaded and installed Linux programs for Windows.
Libre Office, Open Office, Gimp, and several other programs have jumped in leaps and bounds over the past six years.
The problem is, less than 1% of the Windows folks who now use Linux programs ported over to Windows, have made the switch to Linux. The Linux community was hoping that once folks saw how great the Free programs were, they would have a much higher conversion ratio. Their hopes had basically backfired on them!
But then another group said, did it really? Even Windows is moving to using Linux, hi hi.
And Ubuntu is pulling in over 250 Million a year, most of which passes on to Canonical.
Canonical made a lot of its money from the Ubuntu Software Center until they closed it down a few years ago to pursue other revenue producing software products.
I know that is small peanuts compared to Apple raking in over 250 billion dollars a year.
And Mickey$oft more than double that amount, possibly even triple or quadruple.
However, in the case of both Apple and Mickey$oft, the revenues reported is mostly from other industries and investments, not solely from the software. I think they made only a little over 100 billion from their software.
Some sources say it is much lower, only around 35 billion is from software licenses.
Another staggering figure is how many Windows users have downloaded and installed Linux programs for Windows.
Libre Office, Open Office, Gimp, and several other programs have jumped in leaps and bounds over the past six years.
The problem is, less than 1% of the Windows folks who now use Linux programs ported over to Windows, have made the switch to Linux. The Linux community was hoping that once folks saw how great the Free programs were, they would have a much higher conversion ratio. Their hopes had basically backfired on them!
But then another group said, did it really? Even Windows is moving to using Linux, hi hi.
Re: Peppermint Linux
I do know people are making money selling products with the Linux kernel - I'm thinking of your suggestion that iOS and Android is really Linux in disguise. Didn't realize Ubuntu was that profitable and only was vaguely aware of Fedora's business adventures. All those companies might be rooted in a Linux kernel, although I would argue that the end product is no such thing. You may not be surprised to learn that the last version of Windows Office I installed on my computers was dated 1998. I've been using the free and open source versions ever since.
When I point out the shortcomings of FOSS and the open source concept I'm talking about software that I have personally used. Being a hacker at heart I can easily understand how somebody would become enthralled with creation of a new and improved OS based on the FOSS Linux kernel. There are some pretty creative products out there and some of them work as advertised.
It should come as no surprise to you that Gimp and LibreOffice are preferred by huge numbers of Windows users. They are free after all. I could not venture to guess what the proportion is, but I can confidently say that the vast majority of software installed on a given Windows machine is the free version. Nobody wants to pay for something they can get free, even if it originated in Linux-land. As to why does that not enthuse people enough to change OS's, all you need to do is re-read my gripes about Linux. My problems are insignificant compared to what other people are seeing. I used to think I could recommend a Linux distribution to somebody who truly wanted to migrate, but that's not the case anymore. I might come up with a suggestion but it would be accompanied with a long list of warnings. LOL Above and beyond all that, Windows users are no different than anybody else. It's a lot easier to stick with what you got than it is to learn something new.
When I point out the shortcomings of FOSS and the open source concept I'm talking about software that I have personally used. Being a hacker at heart I can easily understand how somebody would become enthralled with creation of a new and improved OS based on the FOSS Linux kernel. There are some pretty creative products out there and some of them work as advertised.
It should come as no surprise to you that Gimp and LibreOffice are preferred by huge numbers of Windows users. They are free after all. I could not venture to guess what the proportion is, but I can confidently say that the vast majority of software installed on a given Windows machine is the free version. Nobody wants to pay for something they can get free, even if it originated in Linux-land. As to why does that not enthuse people enough to change OS's, all you need to do is re-read my gripes about Linux. My problems are insignificant compared to what other people are seeing. I used to think I could recommend a Linux distribution to somebody who truly wanted to migrate, but that's not the case anymore. I might come up with a suggestion but it would be accompanied with a long list of warnings. LOL Above and beyond all that, Windows users are no different than anybody else. It's a lot easier to stick with what you got than it is to learn something new.
Re: Peppermint Linux
I don't think I would be wrong if I said that the vast majority of Windows users could not install Windows on a new empty Hard Drive. Some even have problems installing a new piece of software from an install disk. They don't know how to answer some of the questions, because they don't know what's inside their machine.
This is an area where Linux actually shines. You want a new piece of software, just go to Synaptic and select it. Even if you have to get the software on-line, programs like GDebi Package Installer will handle the task for you.
If you can find someone who knows how to install Windows on an empty hard drive, they can probably install one of the Turn-Key Linux Distro's without problems also.
After all, look how many people learned to use their Schmartz-Fone which normally runs on Linux.
If they got a computer with Linux already installed, about the only thing different they will see is that their old Windows programs don't run on it, at least not directly.
Most people only use computers for web browsing, and there really is no difference between how the web browsers look or work whether on Windows or Linux computers.
This is an area where Linux actually shines. You want a new piece of software, just go to Synaptic and select it. Even if you have to get the software on-line, programs like GDebi Package Installer will handle the task for you.
If you can find someone who knows how to install Windows on an empty hard drive, they can probably install one of the Turn-Key Linux Distro's without problems also.
After all, look how many people learned to use their Schmartz-Fone which normally runs on Linux.
If they got a computer with Linux already installed, about the only thing different they will see is that their old Windows programs don't run on it, at least not directly.
Most people only use computers for web browsing, and there really is no difference between how the web browsers look or work whether on Windows or Linux computers.
Re: Peppermint Linux
Well, I have to disagree on one point. I just installed a brand new version of Windows 7 on an empty disk right out of the box. All I had to tel lit was my name, password, and what language I wanted. It never asked about my keyboard layout as does ever Linux OS I ever installed. More importantly Windows just installed without me needing to partition anything. Since I have 5 hard drives on this machine it did ask which one, but that's it. From this single experience alone I would say installing Windows is easier. I have more to report on this subject elsewhere. Oh, and by the way, unlike Linux, Windows 7 did not destroy the bootloaders of any of my Linux installations.
When it comes to adding software using synaptic you can only say it is easy because you have a boatload of experience with it. Synaptic lists thousands of packages with ambiguous names that tell you nothing about it's usage. Plus, you better have the right dependencies available - something Windows users never heard of. And, if you want to use synaptic to remove a package, it will not do a complete removal and might even lock up your system because the dependencies are mismatched. Of course, you know how to deal with all that, but the bimbo who just has to answer some logical questions when installing Windows doesn't.
Don't get me started with Linux and UEFI. LOL
When you talk about people learning to use smartphones, they are not learning how to use the operating system. They are learning how to use the software running on the underlying OS. I suppose it's possible, but I never heard or read about anybody installing Android into their phone, nor any other OS. All they deal with are apps and that's a whole different ballgame than operating systems.
When it comes to performing tasks, such as browsing, mail, and composing notes, there is no OS that is better than the others. You complain about MS Word not being logical but that is not part of the OS. A lot of crap software is out there, even in the world of Linux. When it comes to basics the only consideration should be cost and appearance. They all do the same thing in the end.
When it comes to adding software using synaptic you can only say it is easy because you have a boatload of experience with it. Synaptic lists thousands of packages with ambiguous names that tell you nothing about it's usage. Plus, you better have the right dependencies available - something Windows users never heard of. And, if you want to use synaptic to remove a package, it will not do a complete removal and might even lock up your system because the dependencies are mismatched. Of course, you know how to deal with all that, but the bimbo who just has to answer some logical questions when installing Windows doesn't.
Don't get me started with Linux and UEFI. LOL
When you talk about people learning to use smartphones, they are not learning how to use the operating system. They are learning how to use the software running on the underlying OS. I suppose it's possible, but I never heard or read about anybody installing Android into their phone, nor any other OS. All they deal with are apps and that's a whole different ballgame than operating systems.
When it comes to performing tasks, such as browsing, mail, and composing notes, there is no OS that is better than the others. You complain about MS Word not being logical but that is not part of the OS. A lot of crap software is out there, even in the world of Linux. When it comes to basics the only consideration should be cost and appearance. They all do the same thing in the end.
Re: Peppermint Linux
Windows is sold in the language of different countries, they don't normally include all possible languages one might be installing the OS in. While Linux Distro's are usually the same throughout the world, so they let you pick what language you want to install, along with what type of keyboard. QWERTY is not the only one out there.
Ha, Windows had DLL files, gazzillions of them spread out all over their file system, and tons of gz files as well.
You install a program normally the DLL files are included and get installed, but not always.
And when you remove the program it usually leaves all those DLL files behind.
In Linux, if a program is in Synaptic, it will load all missing dependencies for you.
And if you do a complete removal, it will remove the dependencies it install, but only if they are not used by other programs, else they leave it alone.
Well, with Windows, you only get One Appearance, with Linux there are Thousands you can select from, hi hi.
And if the only consideration is cost, Linux wins hands down simply because it is free.
And yes, they all do the same thing in the end, so free is the best way to go!
Ha, Windows had DLL files, gazzillions of them spread out all over their file system, and tons of gz files as well.
You install a program normally the DLL files are included and get installed, but not always.
And when you remove the program it usually leaves all those DLL files behind.
In Linux, if a program is in Synaptic, it will load all missing dependencies for you.
And if you do a complete removal, it will remove the dependencies it install, but only if they are not used by other programs, else they leave it alone.
Well, with Windows, you only get One Appearance, with Linux there are Thousands you can select from, hi hi.
And if the only consideration is cost, Linux wins hands down simply because it is free.
And yes, they all do the same thing in the end, so free is the best way to go!
Re: Peppermint Linux
The Windows vs Linux argument is so old that it has hairy mold growing on it already. I've read quite a bit outside these forums and have visited a lot of the tech support websites for Linux. Add that to my personal experience with everything we just talked about, and I must say that I've had a lot less trouble installing Windows - the OS not it's programs - than I did with the same experience using Linux. Having multiple choices to set up an operating system is not an advantage. It merely introduces more opportunities for failure. Did I ever tell you about the time I installed the Budgie desktop alongside the Gnome desktop? Yes I did; it's in these forums somewhere. When I used synaptic to remove Budgie it did not remove all the dependencies that Budgie wanted. Because of that, the OS became unstable and I had to reinstall it. So much for choices. 
If you're going to complain about dll's I will remind you that Linux has configuration files that exceed the complexity of anything I've seen in Windows. And that includes the registry. Of course you are going well beyond the needs of a casual user if you have to worry about configuration files or link libraries. If you're going to mess with an OS at that level, you deserve all the hassle you get. My complaint with Linux is that it forces me to that level way more often than does Windows.
If you're going to complain about dll's I will remind you that Linux has configuration files that exceed the complexity of anything I've seen in Windows. And that includes the registry. Of course you are going well beyond the needs of a casual user if you have to worry about configuration files or link libraries. If you're going to mess with an OS at that level, you deserve all the hassle you get. My complaint with Linux is that it forces me to that level way more often than does Windows.
Re: Peppermint Linux
I don't know how many times I had Windows programs where I had to go out hunting for DLLs in order to get it to work.
Usually when I had to do this, I would save the missing DLL in the program folder so if I wanted to install it on another machine, I had it available.
Back when I was using Windows, I kept a backup folder that contained every DLL from every machine. That folder came in handy many a time. There are some older Windows games that Debi loves to play, games like Jezzball. Although you can drop the exe program on nearly any machine version and it works, you have to have certain other files to get the sounds which for some reason are not stored in the Jezzball folder.
Seems like I managed to find every file it needed and put them all in the folder, and it also seems I could tell it to look in the folder for everything too. Been years since I messed with Windows so I have forgotten how I did it.
Linux is also getting convoluted to some extent. It used to be all you had to do was copy /home to a new machine and all was OK, except for the program settings. To get those moved you had to copy I think it was /usr and /.config as well, but don't quote me on that.
You can't get by doing that anymore or you'll end up with a mountain of version mismatch errors, hi hi.
So I just keep a list of what programs I want installed on a new Linux machine and have Synaptic do all of them for me at once, hi hi. Then I have another few lists of setting I like to change in each program so they all work as I'm accustomed to using them. But sometimes they change a program enough some of those setting are either no longer available, or done in a different way.
I stopped in the Library on the way home from the vet with one of our pooches to drop of some books Debi had checked out. Got to talking to the tech guy who was doing something with one of their newest computers.
There is a new sticker on top of the machine that says Win10EdV1903, while the other new machine has an older sticker that says Win10PrV1903. He said he is changing all the machines at all of the libraries to Win 10 Education which has more features than Win 10 Pro. Then he started talking about loT low and loT high and was well above my head with that one.
They are working on getting all of the machines set up to be upgraded from their home office and not have to send me out to do them manually. Said if I have a Win 10 machine, updates will no longer happen automatically anymore, only security updates. If I want to upgrade I have to go download the upgrade myself. Everyone will get 30 days warnings.
I guess you already knew all of that though!
Usually when I had to do this, I would save the missing DLL in the program folder so if I wanted to install it on another machine, I had it available.
Back when I was using Windows, I kept a backup folder that contained every DLL from every machine. That folder came in handy many a time. There are some older Windows games that Debi loves to play, games like Jezzball. Although you can drop the exe program on nearly any machine version and it works, you have to have certain other files to get the sounds which for some reason are not stored in the Jezzball folder.
Seems like I managed to find every file it needed and put them all in the folder, and it also seems I could tell it to look in the folder for everything too. Been years since I messed with Windows so I have forgotten how I did it.
Linux is also getting convoluted to some extent. It used to be all you had to do was copy /home to a new machine and all was OK, except for the program settings. To get those moved you had to copy I think it was /usr and /.config as well, but don't quote me on that.
You can't get by doing that anymore or you'll end up with a mountain of version mismatch errors, hi hi.
So I just keep a list of what programs I want installed on a new Linux machine and have Synaptic do all of them for me at once, hi hi. Then I have another few lists of setting I like to change in each program so they all work as I'm accustomed to using them. But sometimes they change a program enough some of those setting are either no longer available, or done in a different way.
I stopped in the Library on the way home from the vet with one of our pooches to drop of some books Debi had checked out. Got to talking to the tech guy who was doing something with one of their newest computers.
There is a new sticker on top of the machine that says Win10EdV1903, while the other new machine has an older sticker that says Win10PrV1903. He said he is changing all the machines at all of the libraries to Win 10 Education which has more features than Win 10 Pro. Then he started talking about loT low and loT high and was well above my head with that one.
They are working on getting all of the machines set up to be upgraded from their home office and not have to send me out to do them manually. Said if I have a Win 10 machine, updates will no longer happen automatically anymore, only security updates. If I want to upgrade I have to go download the upgrade myself. Everyone will get 30 days warnings.
I guess you already knew all of that though!
Re: Peppermint Linux
You were quite the magician when you used Windows. LOL Those .dll files are program specific, but they often refer to shared resources such as audio drivers. The program developer has the responsibility of keeping his dll's current but that rarely happens in practice. Microsoft changes things too often. It's the same situation in Linux. I've been struggling lately trying to figure out exactly how Grub is supposed to work. It's not the same program it used to be when I started using Linux; two major version changes have been made since then. As of today I am still in the dark about much of Grub and how it is generated. The issue became more convoluted than usual when they started using UEFI. There is Grub, and there is Grub. But good luck trying to figure out what you have and how to make it work. It's one reason I'm considering switching over to reFINd. As soon as I get my Windows 7 set up for its trip to the graveyard, I might just replace all the bootloaders in the tower and stick with reFINd.
I use the command line and APT to install a list of must-have programs when I set up a new Linux distro. I don't see the advantage of Synaptic other than it has something like a GUI to work with. You know what you want before you start the upgrade, but trying to find it in Synaptic is a nightmare if you don't know all that you need and which version of it. APT directly addresses the repositories and downloads whatever is current. Never ran into a dependency problem that I can recall doing it that way, but Synaptic did manage to destroy at least one installation due to dependencies. I guess it's all a matter of what you get used to. I'm happy with the command line and the app store.
I know not of what you talk when it comes to Windows upgrades. I get upgrades once or twice a week because I'm not using the normal Windows 10 Pro. I'm using the Insider Previews which essentially are beta versions that change dynamically. I do have a copy of the October update that went out into the wilds, but using that would be a step backwards. It's like the chromium version of the Edge browser that was just released this week. I have been using that for several months now. Personally I don't think it's a big deal, but technically they say there are a lot of improvements. Well, I'm from Missouri now. You will have to show me.
I use the command line and APT to install a list of must-have programs when I set up a new Linux distro. I don't see the advantage of Synaptic other than it has something like a GUI to work with. You know what you want before you start the upgrade, but trying to find it in Synaptic is a nightmare if you don't know all that you need and which version of it. APT directly addresses the repositories and downloads whatever is current. Never ran into a dependency problem that I can recall doing it that way, but Synaptic did manage to destroy at least one installation due to dependencies. I guess it's all a matter of what you get used to. I'm happy with the command line and the app store.
I know not of what you talk when it comes to Windows upgrades. I get upgrades once or twice a week because I'm not using the normal Windows 10 Pro. I'm using the Insider Previews which essentially are beta versions that change dynamically. I do have a copy of the October update that went out into the wilds, but using that would be a step backwards. It's like the chromium version of the Edge browser that was just released this week. I have been using that for several months now. Personally I don't think it's a big deal, but technically they say there are a lot of improvements. Well, I'm from Missouri now. You will have to show me.
Re: Peppermint Linux
Even though I had the DLL files, often I didn't know where the program was set to look for them. All too often in Windows the file could be placed anywhere they want to place it.
In the process of going through my old IDE hard drives, I'm running across all kinds of things hidden in those old Windows OSs. None of which I really need, but I am picking up a few things I wanted to keep that never got transferred because they were either in a system folder or stashed someplace most unlikely. I even found a folder that had a copy of my old income tax forms in a readable format, which really surprised me big time. My backup copies could only be read by the program that created them, which is why I always made a PDF or other text file from them for safe keeping. 1996 to 1998 were saved as an EPS file, and 1999 to 2002 were in an EPS file, and they displayed as an image icon when I was looking through folders, and ironically, they opened as an image file so I could see exactly what they were. I had never seen either of those two file types before, that I can remember anyhow, especially the one called EPS.
Needless to say, I saved them and also made a TIF and BMP from each to make sure they were still readable. Then I filed them away in my old accounting files folders where I had PDFs of the newer ones.
Yeppers apt-get install programname saves from looking up things in synaptic, and it includes all the dependencies.
However, doing it that way may not trigger the warning about a new version available.
If I need to install a program that is not in Synaptic I will get it from a repository and use the GDebi Package Installer to install it. That way if there is an update, I get a notification of an update or upgrade for that program.
I can only go by what windows 10 was doing before I deleted it.
About once a month, sometimes more often, sometimes less often, it would get an automatic security update that caused a reboot. Other updates would come about once every three months is all. I reformatted the HD and installed the latest version of Mint, and that is what is sitting there running now 24/7. I have a Maze as a screensaver set to run for an hour before it goes to sleep, hi hi. So far, that is about all I'm using that machine for, hi hi.
In the process of going through my old IDE hard drives, I'm running across all kinds of things hidden in those old Windows OSs. None of which I really need, but I am picking up a few things I wanted to keep that never got transferred because they were either in a system folder or stashed someplace most unlikely. I even found a folder that had a copy of my old income tax forms in a readable format, which really surprised me big time. My backup copies could only be read by the program that created them, which is why I always made a PDF or other text file from them for safe keeping. 1996 to 1998 were saved as an EPS file, and 1999 to 2002 were in an EPS file, and they displayed as an image icon when I was looking through folders, and ironically, they opened as an image file so I could see exactly what they were. I had never seen either of those two file types before, that I can remember anyhow, especially the one called EPS.
Needless to say, I saved them and also made a TIF and BMP from each to make sure they were still readable. Then I filed them away in my old accounting files folders where I had PDFs of the newer ones.
Yeppers apt-get install programname saves from looking up things in synaptic, and it includes all the dependencies.
However, doing it that way may not trigger the warning about a new version available.
If I need to install a program that is not in Synaptic I will get it from a repository and use the GDebi Package Installer to install it. That way if there is an update, I get a notification of an update or upgrade for that program.
I can only go by what windows 10 was doing before I deleted it.
About once a month, sometimes more often, sometimes less often, it would get an automatic security update that caused a reboot. Other updates would come about once every three months is all. I reformatted the HD and installed the latest version of Mint, and that is what is sitting there running now 24/7. I have a Maze as a screensaver set to run for an hour before it goes to sleep, hi hi. So far, that is about all I'm using that machine for, hi hi.
Re: Peppermint Linux
I discovered you don't need the "get" part of apt-get. LOL I also start up a root session in a separate terminal to avoid the need for the sudo preface. When you install packages using APT it queries the listed repositories. Whatever is in those repositories is assumed to be the latest stable release. There are a few programs not in the repository which might need to be updated manually, but that's the price you pay for not doing what the master demands. You are on your own if you depart from what is blessed by the developers.
I"m glad you are having fun digging up buried treasure in the Windows system directories. There are hidden files all over the place with good information too. One such directory is AppData which you need to enable in folder preferences to view. You probably already know about it's existence, but if you missed it you are missing some hidden treasures. LOL
I"m glad you are having fun digging up buried treasure in the Windows system directories. There are hidden files all over the place with good information too. One such directory is AppData which you need to enable in folder preferences to view. You probably already know about it's existence, but if you missed it you are missing some hidden treasures. LOL
Re: Peppermint Linux
Some Distro's use Aptitude instead of Apt-Get and others use only Get.
My main goal with those old IDE drives, although each time I got a new computer I copied everything over.
When I started running certain programs and began looking for something I knew I had but couldn't find, at first I thought I must have deleted it for some reason, which wasn't like me at all.
Then I remembered sometimes data is saved in the program file area of a program if you didn't tell it to save someplace specific. And some programs don't let you change where it saves the data to.
I find a few things not really worth saving since it only has to do with older Windows machines.
I actually found the old graphics conversion program I used and loved for years, alas it is for Win95 and did work on Win98 using the Run In Win95 Mode setting. It did not work on WinXP at all though.
Don't know if I would want to trust it to handle today's larger image files, hi hi.
I have newer programs that can generate different file types if need be.
I did find a hidden thumbnail file, and took the time to look through the lo-res images, but it appears I still have the originals of all of them. So I just wasted my time doing that.
I think I mentioned I have some larger size IDE drives that won't fit the docking station, and I'm up to about 5 now that won't read for some reason. I can hear them spin-up alright. But I get the notice Unknown Drive, which I also get with a reformatted empty drive, but at least it shows the name of the drive, not just Unknown.
If I have time I might try installing those few in a computer. I do have a computer with the connectors led to outside the box, but that computer has overheating problems and only runs for about five minutes before it shuts itself down.
I thought it was a bad power supply, but apparently it might be the CPU fan is not spinning.
Wish I would have kept my old computer that I could put a 5-1/4 floppy drive in.
Can't get 5-1/4 to USB adapters due to the power requirements of the 5-1/4 drives, and the fact they come in different speeds also. They require a driver program not found in computers anymore, and of course the connections for them on the MoBo.
My main goal with those old IDE drives, although each time I got a new computer I copied everything over.
When I started running certain programs and began looking for something I knew I had but couldn't find, at first I thought I must have deleted it for some reason, which wasn't like me at all.
Then I remembered sometimes data is saved in the program file area of a program if you didn't tell it to save someplace specific. And some programs don't let you change where it saves the data to.
I find a few things not really worth saving since it only has to do with older Windows machines.
I actually found the old graphics conversion program I used and loved for years, alas it is for Win95 and did work on Win98 using the Run In Win95 Mode setting. It did not work on WinXP at all though.
Don't know if I would want to trust it to handle today's larger image files, hi hi.
I have newer programs that can generate different file types if need be.
I did find a hidden thumbnail file, and took the time to look through the lo-res images, but it appears I still have the originals of all of them. So I just wasted my time doing that.
I think I mentioned I have some larger size IDE drives that won't fit the docking station, and I'm up to about 5 now that won't read for some reason. I can hear them spin-up alright. But I get the notice Unknown Drive, which I also get with a reformatted empty drive, but at least it shows the name of the drive, not just Unknown.
If I have time I might try installing those few in a computer. I do have a computer with the connectors led to outside the box, but that computer has overheating problems and only runs for about five minutes before it shuts itself down.
I thought it was a bad power supply, but apparently it might be the CPU fan is not spinning.
Wish I would have kept my old computer that I could put a 5-1/4 floppy drive in.
Can't get 5-1/4 to USB adapters due to the power requirements of the 5-1/4 drives, and the fact they come in different speeds also. They require a driver program not found in computers anymore, and of course the connections for them on the MoBo.
Re: Peppermint Linux
I now have a collection of ATA drives that were made for laptops. That never stopped me from putting them into the desktop tower where they served me well. I suppose I could dispense with all of them and not miss any data. All I want from those drives is already backed up in a couple different places. Two of them are the old MBR installation for this computer - the longer I use the new format, the more obsolete will those two drives become. I also have a box of optical drives still unpacked from when we moved here. Some of them actually work. LOL And I also have some memory chips, somewhere. Those things could come in handy in an emergency but I'd need to know how to determine the DDR2's from the DDR3's. They all have different speed specifications. I suspect what I have is minor compared to your collection. I don't have anything IDE anymore.
Re: Peppermint Linux
I have a file cabinet drawer half full of 5-1/4 internal floppy drives, a few 3-1/2 floppy drives and no computer with a MoBo that accepts their type of plugs anymore, unless I'm missing something.
Somebody said they could connect to an IDE connector, but I've never tried it.
I thought they had a different amount of pins?
I have over a dozen IDE hard drives, most of them are 80 gig, a couple of 120 gig, and a couple of 200 gig.
Plus the two super old ones I mentioned that are too big to fit in the IDE docking station.
I think they are very small in capacity though, like under a gig, hi hi.
I haven't tossed them yet, I'm hoping I have a CPU fan in my junk box that I didn't throw away the last time I cleaned up and took a big box of things to the ham fest to give away.
Just being able to connect a 5-1/4 drive to a computer, don't mean it has the necessary complex drivers for it anymore.
It may work with a 3-1/2 floppy but not with a 5-1/4.
Somebody said they could connect to an IDE connector, but I've never tried it.
I thought they had a different amount of pins?
I have over a dozen IDE hard drives, most of them are 80 gig, a couple of 120 gig, and a couple of 200 gig.
Plus the two super old ones I mentioned that are too big to fit in the IDE docking station.
I think they are very small in capacity though, like under a gig, hi hi.
I haven't tossed them yet, I'm hoping I have a CPU fan in my junk box that I didn't throw away the last time I cleaned up and took a big box of things to the ham fest to give away.
Just being able to connect a 5-1/4 drive to a computer, don't mean it has the necessary complex drivers for it anymore.
It may work with a 3-1/2 floppy but not with a 5-1/4.
Re: Peppermint Linux
I'm pretty sure you would have trouble with controller cards for those 5 1/4" drives. I'd guess they were all in an 8 bit computer system and would be impossible to kludge into anything existing in 2020. There might be a converter out there, somewhere, but then when you overcome the hardware problem you still have the software problem. If you really really need what's on those disks, you would have better luck finding the hardware, firmware, and software in some bone yard. I think that would be an interesting project, but is it really necessary? LOL
As far as connectors go, I would expect there to be a converter plug for every known combination of connectors. You just have to find it. But, as I noted above, even if you did manage to power up those old drives, that likely would not be enough to retrieve the data.
As far as connectors go, I would expect there to be a converter plug for every known combination of connectors. You just have to find it. But, as I noted above, even if you did manage to power up those old drives, that likely would not be enough to retrieve the data.